Electric Viking

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions Electric Viking

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions Electric Viking

  • Electric Viking

  • G Johns

    Member
    January 26, 2022 at 8:09 am

    Check out “Worlds largest lithium company mass producing solid state batteries” he posted about 12 hours ago. Good change is coming, soon. A couple years from now most propulsion will be powered differently than today. I thought it would take longer but like being wrong.

  • Thomas Bushaw

    Member
    January 26, 2022 at 10:23 am

    Here’s the YouTube link.

  • Llewellyn Evans

    Member
    January 26, 2022 at 3:51 pm

    Before we jump in the deep end here …… the guy in the video questions the source and truth of the report that he read.

    He also says that nobody else is reporting it or repeating it …… so it could be bull dash.

    Does anybody have a link to a legitimate source by one of the companies involved that has real specifications? (not youtube)

    • John Malcom

      Member
      January 26, 2022 at 5:09 pm

      I share your skepticism about this product. Last year I spent two weeks at the BYD facility being indoctrinated on their R&D plans for both EVs (The Dolphin and its successor) and their battery technology on behalf of my employer. BYD (30,000 resources work in R&D) has some exciting things coming but a few more years out. Their blade LFT batteries are their current best technology and they have something similar to what is advertised in the YouTube video. BYD has a separate fully owned company that focuses on battery manufacturing and they also have owned lithium mining resources. Toyota and Daimler have partnered with BMD. both companies are good at doing due diligence, which makes me believe they have the edge.

      Three things are important with any product, especially bleeding edge. Does it work in the lab; can it scale to commercial production levels; and lastly can it be priced to be available to the market place. A fourth and nearly as important in my opinion, is it safe and reliable.

      Just my opinion of course, but the Chinese are vey sensitive to “Status” if this was a sure thing as described, they would be advertising it everywhere and taking credit for their brilliance. Since they are not, they have their own reservations about the technology and the timeline.

      QuantumScape (Well funded by BMW and Volkswagen) is having difficulties with their schedule to bring the technology to market. No reason to believe that anybody working on this technology is not finding roadblocks they did not expect.

      My wife is PRC Chinese and a professor of mathematics. I had her look over this post to see if I overstepped. She thinks that what I have said is “OK”

      But you never know, we might be surprised.

    • Llewellyn Evans

      Member
      January 26, 2022 at 11:16 pm

      According to the article below which looks legitimate, the battery is a quasi solid state. It has both solid and liquid phase electrolyte. It seems like a logical step forwards in that the technology keeps the internal resistance down (liquid electrolyte) and attempts to control dendrites (solid electrolyte), while allowing the use of an anode that contains lithium in its matrix (high energy density).

      Solid-state battery explained. When it’s coming to mass production?

  • Vernon Michael Gardner

    Member
    January 26, 2022 at 6:58 pm

    This story was in the news quite a bit over the last 2 days. After watching the original video and reading some of the sources, I am skeptical over the quality of their products. They did give 50 cars to a government agency. I will follow up with an edit when I have more information about the quality.

    • George Hughes

      Member
      January 26, 2022 at 9:12 pm

      Maybe I’m naïve but given what we see coming in battery tech is something we ought to encourage by configuring and testing new battery chemistries and approaches (solid-state) on the Aptera as the standard platform.

      The idea is that these new technologies can be packaged in the space established for the 100kw battery and also the 25kw battery. Batteries with higher power densities would package 160kw in the 100kw space and deliver a 1,600 mile range.

      Given we’re dealing with different companies providing the battery, BMS, motor controller and user interface so there should be ways to adjust the software to allow battery packs. It has to be so if the goal of a multi-generational vehicle is to be realized and we would be disappointed if, 20 years hence, we had to retain the same battery tech.

      Of course the ultimate goal would be field a viable entry into the Cannonball run.

      • John Malcom

        Member
        January 27, 2022 at 3:28 pm

        I agree, It would be wise for Aptera to do this kind of R&D. Unfortunately, I do not believe they can divert capital to do this work just yet. Perhaps after a reliable revenue stream from the sale of currently configured Apterae, they can move in this direction more fully.

        I am sure they have a plan for future R&D and development they are working on based on their assessment of the market and bleeding/emerging levels of technology, which seems to me to be almost overwhelming (But encouraging) at this time.

  • Carl Knapp Knapp

    Member
    January 27, 2022 at 5:40 pm

    This Ganfeng battery sounds similar in design to Sion Power out of Tucson AZ which has slightly better ratings.

    • John Malcom

      Member
      January 27, 2022 at 8:55 pm

      Thanks for this. I for one will take a look at them since I am interested in the progress of this technology

  • George Hughes

    Member
    January 28, 2022 at 11:51 pm

    Actually, I was kind of hoping independent third-parties, including potential suppliers, might see in the Aptera, given its right to repair approach, the perfect ‘off-the-shelf’ development and testing vehicle.

    I think this is almost deserved based on the Aptera’s industry leading efficiency.

    The idea is that if you have a component that will increase the efficiency of EVs, you might want to demonstrate it on the most efficient vehicle available. Because Aptera uses basically off0the-shelf componentry from third-party suppliers, it would seem a lot of the tricks of interoperability of componentry will have evolved as to minimize alternate components. This should mean Aptera is well along the way of it establishing something like a computer-like architecture with standard bus designs and protocols that ease improvements in both hardware and software.

    I get it that it is wishful thinking th at Aptera be accepted as this vehicle that is basically designed or even intended to ultimately be as much a car of the people as the VW Bug or Model T Ford – both vehicles known for being adapted and improved? by vast numbers of their users.

    I think the proliferation of Aptera video channels and the accrual of trolling bodies to boot show the budding star power of the brand.

    So another perspective is how do we as a community use that star power to establish Aptera as the test mule for all sorts of improvements. The goal being the attendant publicity.

    • John Malcom

      Member
      January 29, 2022 at 11:03 am

      Some good ideas here. “If you build it they will come” may apply here. Once aptera is in the market and creating buzz, then I think your idea of third parties might be possible.

      I also like the thought about finding ways for the community which is growing to help this effort. Perhaps the new approach to employing ambassadors could that as an action.

    • Scott Price

      Member
      January 29, 2022 at 11:32 am

      Agreed with the intent and spirit of your inputs, George. It will be important for owners to be able to replace their existing battery pack in a reasonable manner that does not require extensive customization to match up with future tech. It is of course hard to predict all changes and future interfaces, though non-proprietary software/electrical design and relatively easy physical access + installation of differently configured battery packs within the same available space will be important. This is analogous to their statements that the solar panels (which slowly degrade over time) are designed to be replaced (though the specific method or removing and replacing is still unknown, at least for us).

      This will also help address the concerns of some initial buyers who understandably wonder how they will get general replacement parts if startup company Aptera does not continue into the future, hopefully making some of them more likely to buy and therefore actually increase the chance of Aptera continuing as a viable business.

      ICE vehicles have had the “consistency advantage” that a 2022 model could essentially time warp to a 1980 gas station to fuel up, and vice versa. Battery EVs can have the advantage of actually using better “gas” (battery technology) over time if the vehicle is designed to receive that “new and improved gas” as much as possible from the beginning. It enables our high efficiency / long range vehicles to improve with age. Here’s to Aptera model 1 longevity!

      • Vernon Michael Gardner

        Member
        January 31, 2022 at 12:24 am

        Scott, you are very eloquent.

        The Right to Repair has many elements in it. For decades a technician at a dealership would be privy to knowledge that was not available to the public (ie. a test fix for a reported issue to validate a “possible repair” before a TSB (technical service bulletin) (or recall) is issued. Also making the information available to access an item or component for a needed diagnosis and/or repair. Having the specifications that the manufacturer uses is such a big help. The manufacturers were so secretive about some of the items in a vehicle that they would not even give the tech. the spec. they were looking for to make many diagnoses and/or repairs. Industry secrets I guess.

        Right to Repair comes down to the need for more transparency. 3rd parties do help by doing their own work and sharing their findings with the world, usually through a pay as you go service.

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