All about Gamma

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions All about Gamma

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions All about Gamma

  • All about Gamma

  • Carl Knapp Knapp

    Member
    July 21, 2022 at 9:42 pm

    I see the new Gamma design of Aptera in the recently added Fleet tab of their website. What ideas can you think of where Aptera could promote this vehicle online or at events to the fleet and rental market that would not cost much?

    At 355 MPGe I recall a person that wanted to use it for a group of Uber Eats drivers. I talked to a business owner that owns more than a half dozen E-bike stores in the hot Southwest and rents out EV vehicles. He saw a good fit for Aptera because it has room for luggage, heat, and air conditioning. He plans to add his company logo to the vehicles to increase his exposure. Plus he said a vehicle “Driven by the Sun” looks more like a vehicle “Driven for Fun”.

  • Curtis Cibinel

    Member
    July 21, 2022 at 10:27 pm

    They really should have mocked up a fake company wrap in the fleet renderings. The aptera is an incredibly eye catching vehicle and for many businesses a fleet vehicle is as much about being a rolling billboard as a tool to get around.

  • kerbe2705

    Member
    July 21, 2022 at 11:35 pm
  • David Marlow

    Member
    July 22, 2022 at 1:59 am

    it will be very interesting to see how other EV’s do in rental fleets, is customer interest growing?

    Now with the lower priced Bolt will rental fleets now offer it as an economy car pricing?

    <font face=”inherit”>When will the fleet managers start noticing the lower </font>maintenance<font face=”inherit”> cost’s?</font>

    I do not see Aptera as a great big city vehicle, but a great open road vehicle, especially with its longer range and faster charging MPH than other EV’s.

  • Len Nowak

    Moderator
    July 22, 2022 at 6:18 am

    Yes sir!

    What I had sent in , over the years (in blog threads and info@aptera.us ) …any services that could work within the two seater, 500# payload and cargo design etc…

    Like some of these that come to mind at the moment…

    Home Health nurse, computer tech, any Sales Rep, Solar, Home finishes/repair , pest service sales, mall/casino/community /stadium security , any food delivery service, ZAP vehicle service etc

    I live in big retirement state. Golf carts are used often to scoot around. The Aptera will not fit in the town’s dedicated cart lanes but… who wants to get behind a cart😉 Aptera is much safer too!

    Campuses like Corporate, Hospital , Universities, Government have maintenance and transport ( shuttles ) small vehicles

    Isn’t there a move to electrify Federal vehicles?!

    Hey you know the *EVSE-Angels we hope will form in greater numbers… to audit public EVSE… What better vehicle to check out and report status of the public EVSE as they soak up some of their power from the sun! ( I suggested *this in a ADOT meeting talking about our state’s EVSE Roll Out Plans)

    ⚡️ on!


  • Dan Stevens

    Member
    July 22, 2022 at 11:16 am

    You can see a better image (the full image used on the fleet page) at:
    https://i.imgur.com/wnhYHwA.jpg

    I’m guessing these are renders, but it could be a touched up version of the actual gamma vehicle. There is definitely a lot of photoshop work done on this image so it is a bit hard to tell.

    The image is good to see though, looks like a LOT of progress over Alpha / Beta (not that beta was ever much to look at).

    Now, to get the production line in place!

    View post on imgur.com

  • George Hughes

    Member
    July 22, 2022 at 12:08 pm

    Perusing the fleet page, I see the first ‘entity’ listed are utilities.

    In year’s past, utilities – think member-driven co-ops – have been known to ‘sponsor’ products for their customers. Many are engaged in community development and all sorts of things like industrial development, etc. – you know locally subsidized 100,000 sq. ft. facilities including green field communities – where local economies chug along with opportunities being less frequent than in past decades.

    And here Aptera comes with a package that includes six component areas to build a complete vehicle that could, in the case of electric utilities, have a special ‘sharing’ relationship on their 1000 mile batteries that effectively makes each vehicle a ‘node’ in a distributed battery backup system deployed in the co-op’s service area.

    The “local” assembly plant becomes a joint-venture and would make from 5,000 to 20,000 Aptera … or maybe a local ‘inventor’ see’s how to cobble together any thing from an electric tractor for farming operations to an electric pickup all made using the Aptera formula of modular components and composite monocoque construction.

    And because these utility-built Aptera are part of a utility led smart grid design (distributed battery backup) they make the vehicles available to their customers at subsidized rates. The switch enabling the subsidy would likely be from the software with possibly a digital key inserted in the vehicle. That means customers would have the option to participate in the subsidy or not.

    Then there is the per-use rental gig where the Aptera earns money by the mile and, because of the integration with the grid in these utility compliant vehicles, the utilities can use the aggregate battery storage while making a profit from its use by individuals as a rental vehicle.

    Aptera would in a sense adopt a mixed ‘franchise’ structure with franchised makers like the utilities choosing their production runs and ultimately new products, which could be developed and engineered by Aptera and its franchisee’s under the agreements. (Kind of like when a franchisee adds a new menu item that proves popular and is adopted by the franchisor.)

    And as far as the fleet vehicles, they can buy them, which is fine, but going the route of making them expands the growth and benefits of Aptera to the broadest possible market more quickly than any other method; thus saving the world (The world is ‘saved’ if there are 2 million Aptera on the road in 2030.)

    PS: We can never forget that we’re on a tight timeline with the environment. The genius of Aptera’s construction and assembly is that is essentially moving to commodify the components into parts products. The more widely used those commodified components are, the stronger the restraint on pricing as different suppliers may be drawn to produce particular components if those components are easily adapted to multiple vehicles designed on the same lean engineering concepts of Aptera.

    Indeed, our salvation is not with the technology, but rather the technology being accessible in a time of economic uncertainty.

    Could you imagine the stock value of Aptera stock if an announcement that they had partnered with suppliers x,y and z and a major electric utility in the southeast to assemble over the next five years 60,000 smart-grid compatible vehicles that, in aggregate, represents six-gigawatts of battery storage available to the grid for backup. The utility announces it will produced these smart-grid capable Aptera for use in its operations fleet, in a on-demand rental offering in the city and as a vehicle customers can lease at subsidized rates that cut the cost of transportation expenses in a family to under 10 percent of the average household income, freeing the family from the expensive burden of ownership including insurance.

    The prospect of these kinds of announcements in the future, makes me excited.

    PS: What America really needs is the broad-based education possible through the proliferation of lean-design concepts demonstrated by Aptera’s manufacturing design. Folks see that, they understand it and innovation returns and we make additional steps toward sustainable living.

  • David Marlow

    Member
    August 1, 2022 at 1:08 am

    So Aptera knows they must get the major things right on this one.

    Once the claims of range, solar miles of charging /day, acceleration and handling are proven to major reviewers, investors will line up and orders will pour in.

    So they must meet or exceed the spec’s with this one.

  • Christopher Barrett

    Member
    August 1, 2022 at 4:18 am

    One other important matrix, the crash testing. It’s my hope that they beat the best crash tested vehicle! My gut says, many look upon the three wheels, and see vulnerability. Instead, I see a very strong composite, and agility for accident avoidance, like nothing else on the road. Many folks have bought Volvos, and Saabs for years, based on the crash tests showing that they are good in a crash. If Aptera can match, or exceed that, then minds will be changed about it. No question this is a game changer, but if proven to be extra safe, above other things, this will be a great help for the adoption of the brand.

  • Llewellyn Evans

    Member
    August 1, 2022 at 4:24 am

    I agree that Gamma is important for validation before production and for further testing.

    It will be interesting to see if funding comes after Gamma.

    I am sure Gamma will be an awesome success and reach most if not all of the goals Aptera has set for themselves.

    I am a lot more concerned about Aptera getting enough investment capital to reach full scale production. Some news on this would help ease my mind.

  • Jonah Jorgenson

    Member
    August 1, 2022 at 6:32 am

    Pretty big claim in your post. Not sure the current business environment supports such a rosy outlook.

    I do agree they need to make good on their performance claims based on engineering simulations with real world test data. Especially the safety testing

    • David Marlow

      Member
      August 1, 2022 at 9:36 am

      Safety testing will wait for the Delta’s if it finds problems, production will be delayed until resolved.

      Currently Aptera seem to be hoping for an investing whale. However getting enough great reviews should bring in plenty of sharks. Also after those great reviews would be a good time to go public.

  • George Hughes

    Member
    August 1, 2022 at 8:20 am

    There is a old saying, “Build a better mousetrap and the world will beat a path to your door.”

    That is the promise of Aptera and to accomplish that task, they’ve designed the Aptera along first principles of efficiency and safety with an ample dose of performance (3.5 sec 0-60).

    As far as safety, the impact of such up-front design can be seen on the rather odd-looking Smart fortwo which has sold over a 1 million units over the last 20 years. (That’s over 50,000/yr.)

    While the Aptera fails to provide the ultra-compact length and width of the fortwo, that little bugger is also a two-seater with obviously less utility (carrying capacities), performance (slow v. very fast), and, for my two cents, improved safety.

    The ‘amazing’ thing about the fortwo was its comparative crash safety which is based on its passenger compartment crash safety, which, given the vehicles diminutive size, seem almost miraculous. I’m betting the four-part composite monocoque design of the Aptera will surpass the Fortwo by a significant amount. That is not to say that hitting a fixed barrier at 110mph will be a easily survivable, but it should pass the 50-mph barrier crash in a manner that will turn heads (assuming they get the air-bags right.)

    The reality is that little old Aptera has made such a leap into the future with its composite construction that eliminates the outrageous number of heavy, stamped steel parts welded together by a long line of robots (recreating the slip-shod process formerly done by autoworkers), increases strength by a factor of 2+ (crush strength and rigidity) with a dramatic decrease in the costs of labor (including robot labor) that more than compensates for the use of modern light-weight, ultra-strong materials.

    When Steve and Chris anointed their introductory model “Paradigm” the hit the nail on the head. The Aptera way is that kind of shift largely because they are producing the first optimized composite body and frame. (The Vette is fiberglass bodied but is still built on a steel-framed vehicle with and ICE engine.)

    Detroit and the entire auto industry, however, will continue to cling for dear life to the steel-framed and bodied designs they first began using with the Model T Ford.

    My interests in Aptera is based on its pioneering of the composite monocoque design that has its roots in formula 1. It is not that car makers don’t know about such design innovations, but the guys who operate the robots and managers and their workers all are still onboard with the obsolete, heavy and essentially weak welded steel model of manufacture because, well, their jobs depend on it.

    While Tesla is innovating with its megapress techniques for forming large portions of the frame through high-presssure molten aluminum injection to create front and rear cradles; it has still bought into the steel-bodied car approach.

    This is the big decision that most feel is wrong because it is so damned inefficient producing vehicles that are designed under the rubric of planned obsolescence.

    This big switch to composite materials (and they will change and evolve and become even stronger with additions like 2DPA-1) the big difference between Aptera and Tesla and everyone else.

    Maybe we should call one of the models Seabiscuit 🙂

  • David Marlow

    Member
    August 10, 2022 at 4:05 pm

    Sense the only pic’s we have seen so far of Gamma have been of the interior, they must still be working on the solar. It is very important that they get it working meeting there performance spec’s.

    At this time they may not have to prove reparability or lifetime spec’s.

    • Mark Salyzyn

      Member
      August 10, 2022 at 4:37 pm

      🙁

      I only hear the seven stages of grief in your posting.

      I feel your pain, I understand your pain. The only fix is Aptera has to prove Gamma is done, inside, outside and all in between. Software and Hardware. When you finally crack is the only variable, would it be ok if Gamma came out next month?

      Also, face it, Delta is Gamma made in production equipment rather than an all nighter with the engineers in the garage. If it is anything else, just means more production slippage …

  • OZ (It’s OZ, Just OZ)

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 1:04 pm

    Gamma has dropped; From Aptera. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlSBvucps9Y

  • Gary Aiello

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 1:20 pm

    Even more excited now, but what do I do for the next year waiting to get mine, except keep on dreaming about it

  • Pistonboy Delux

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 1:45 pm

    Notice the charging is behind the rear license plate. There is no charger connector there, only the hole for one. Notice the size? What is the only connector that would fit that hole !

    • Francis Giroux

      Member
      August 12, 2022 at 2:32 pm

      The J1772 without the CCS could fit there, but that would be incomplete, but probably all I need. I would of course prefer the Tesla connector.

  • Jonah Jorgenson

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 2:06 pm

    I guess this is what constitutes the gamma drop, or a half of one, or a quarter of one. A little underwhelming for such a milestone event and still mostly focusing on the inside. A little “Side” an instant of “Front” and a “Back” that answers the question about where the charge port will be. I guess we will be getting a Tesla plug. Will need to find a CCS1 adapter somewhere. Hopefully, Aptera will sell or provide one. Understand Chris’s videos now trying to justify/convince about a decision to use a Tesla plug. We will be getting the Little Kitty yoke. I will adjust to that.

    Still unanswered questions about what the other “Things” are on the back, visors, solar on dash etc.

    Wish once we could get a whole story from Aptera at one time.

    At least we know gamma exists in some form. No indication that it is complete or operational.

  • Ray Holan

    Moderator
    August 12, 2022 at 2:11 pm

    Thanks, OZ. I do like the white interior even though it means I’ll need to carry a cleanup kit — my daily errands invariably end up with debris and smudges in places that surprise me;)

    I’m 6 ft. so I appreciate the comments from the taller guy about having enough head room.

    I’m also relieved that what appears to be a fabric-like covering (gray) on the yoke is a darker color that will not show dirt as readily.

  • Jared Cormier

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 2:18 pm

    The bulb on the back is probably for license plate and charging port illumination.

    • Dennis Swaney

      Member
      August 12, 2022 at 2:45 pm

      That makes sense because of the legal requirement for rear plates to be illuminated at night. That it will also help plugging in after dark is just gravy.

  • robert engelhart

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 2:19 pm

    Are they kidding me with this 2 min video, really!!.

    You could almost make the same video panning and zooming into the 4 photos they released last week. Didn’t even bother to power up the displays!! They zoomed in on some fabric WOW.

    • Francis Giroux

      Member
      August 12, 2022 at 2:39 pm

      Patience is a virtue that takes practice to develop. I’m not complaining about not seeing a back-up camera. I’m sure it will show up later, or I’ll install an aftermarket one. Otherwise, I like what I see, I won’t fret about what I do not see. Yet.

    • Russell Fauver

      Member
      August 13, 2022 at 10:22 am

      Probably didn’t want to show more because the vehicle was incomplete at the time of filming. You’ll notice the gas and brake pedals were not installed. There seemed to be no power to the vehicle since no lights or screens were on. The plug to charge the car was not installed. There’s a strange mounting bracket on the floor next to the driver’s foot that looks like something needs attached to it. I didn’t see any signs of solar on the vehicle dash, roof, hood or hatch. Definitely a work in progress. I liked everything I saw in the video so far. I’m really looking forward to future updates as it progresses through its assembly process.

      • Norman Roberts

        Moderator
        August 13, 2022 at 2:58 pm

        you could see the pedals in other views

      • Kevin Bradbury

        Member
        August 13, 2022 at 2:59 pm

        @Russell Fauver – You are correct in that the vehicle does seem incomplete. However, I want to correct a couple of observations. The “strange mounting bracket” is strange, but it is mounted on top of the tunnel/hump. Anyone’s guess as what it could be for. My first guess with no wagering behind it, is for wiring. In a video from Aptera Owner’s Club, it shows the gas and brake pedals installed but are not in your screen grab due to camera angle. The AOC video shows that they are very standard pedals and not the + and – pedals shown in the computer rendering of gamma(kinda dissappointing). I too like many things shown and finding it hard to wait for the completed reveal with a thorough walk around hopefully to go with it.

        Actually, you can see a portion of the accelerator pedal in the above pic. The bottom of the green circle runs right over the top of it.

  • Alain Chuzel

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 2:32 pm

    Any one else concerned about the status of the solar panel development? Because I’m solar-obsessed, throughout the video I did nothing but look for a hint of a solar cell and saw nothing. Someone talk me down please!

    • Dennis Swaney

      Member
      August 12, 2022 at 2:41 pm

      Maybe the only obvious changes were the addition of more cells outside and the reduction of the number on the dash that was covered a couple of weeks ago? Perhaps some of the nitty-gritty changes will be announced at the event in September.

    • Steven G. Bueche

      Member
      August 12, 2022 at 2:44 pm

      I did freeze the video where I could see the tail section. Didn’t see any solar there. Maybe those tiles were the ones they referred to when they said they’d made room for more tiles on the roof and hood (I suspect) It would save on thin wires needing to run from the back of the car for 6 tiles.

      I do like the white pineapple leather. If it’s like the Tesla you simply wipe it with a baby wipe.

      The interior looks clean and minimalist. I suspect the center console hasn’t had any of the optional sections placed. Cleaner hinges, Intuitive new nose section and wheel covers all looks good.

      Not crazy about a fabric yoke covering but the fabric looks tough like the older Jeep have. Mine is 25 years old and still looks good.

      So far, it’s a hit out of the park for me.

  • Pistonboy Delux

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 2:40 pm

    While the solar is a great idea, it is not that important to me. If they had a solid rear hatch with no solar cells on it, I would gladly take it. The rear hatch window lets in prying eyes and too much hot sunlight for me.

    Aptera is the only two seater EV. Plus it is sporty and affordable.

  • Bob Kirchner

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 2:47 pm

    I hope they’ve made progress on more than just the interior by now.

    • Llewellyn Evans

      Member
      August 12, 2022 at 4:39 pm

      The interior looks high quality and well thought out.

      If the rest of the car has seen the same attention to detail, then we are in for a treat!😀

  • Dennis Swaney

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 2:48 pm

    I don’t like how the seat back is severely reclined; hopefully it will be adjustable. At least one of the employees was filmed moving the seat itself closer to the pedals.

    • Dennis Swaney

      Member
      August 12, 2022 at 7:01 pm

      Yep, I missed that. For a video supposedly about the interior, they could have actually shown the seat back adjustment.

    • kerbe2705

      Member
      August 12, 2022 at 11:24 pm

      @Dennis Swaney Both women have the seatback more upright and one of the guys has it more reclined than others…

  • Kevin Bradbury

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 5:02 pm

    “I want an Oompa Loo…erm….I want an Aptera. I want an Aptera NOW!”

    I guess I better start taking glucosamine and chondroitin supplements and keep my knees limber to get in and out of it.😆

    • Peter Dezendorf

      Member
      August 12, 2022 at 5:18 pm

      Getting in should be no problem. Getting out? That could be a problem…….

    • Paul Schultz

      Member
      August 12, 2022 at 6:15 pm

      Yes, I ran through the people exiting in slow motion and all of them were balancing on one leg, leaning forward while deftly pulling the trailing right leg/foot out of the foot well, over the door jamb and out. Some received extra points from the judges as they maintained a pointed toe during the process!

      • Kevin Bradbury

        Member
        August 12, 2022 at 7:15 pm

        The getting in, even the youngins seemed to really have to bend the knee and pull the toes up. Getting out, saw a couple of them drag the trailing foot out across the door frame.

        I’m afraid that at some point I’m going to “stick the landing”, with my face, on the ground, probably in front of people.😕

        • Paul Schultz

          Member
          August 12, 2022 at 8:06 pm

          I bet they were instructed to make it look as easy as possible with no, or little, need to use hands on doors or frame for support. It might have actually appeared easier if they did use their hands for support ad they transitioned.

        • Russell Fauver

          Member
          August 13, 2022 at 3:28 am

          Me too! I can see me snagging my toe and going down. I’ll need to come up with a different exit strategy.

          • John Voules

            Member
            August 13, 2022 at 10:23 am

            As I reviewed the video again….I realized if they had standard doors it would be nearly impossible to get out in that fashion. With a new car there will always be some kind of adjustment to entering your vehicle. We must 1st learn to enter the APTERA, then learn to function it’s steering then master the final exit. Can’t wait to get at it.

            • Russell Fauver

              Member
              August 13, 2022 at 10:37 am

              True. On the plus side, I noticed they weren’t bumping their heads on the door as they exited. They must have set the door hinges at a different angle from the alphas. I noticed a few people bumping their heads on the door at the Electrify Expo.

            • kerbe2705

              Member
              August 18, 2022 at 3:40 pm

              @Russell Fauver Since the Alpha, the door shape and the body shape have changed: The door has gotten larger and the body side is more upright. The hinges, too, have changed: The door now appears to open a bit more “up” than “out”.

Viewing 1 - 25 of 93 replies

or to reply.

Original Post
0 of 0 posts June 2018
Now