How efficient will the skin cooling be?

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions How efficient will the skin cooling be?

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions How efficient will the skin cooling be?

  • How efficient will the skin cooling be?

     kerbe2705 updated 4 days, 2 hours ago 13 Members · 17 Posts
  • David Pastorek

    Member
    May 30, 2022 at 5:16 pm

    So the Noir Black looks great, but will the dark color be a problem on hot sunny days? The only depiction of where the skin cooling is located that I could find looked like it was along the lower sides of the Aptera. Does anyone know if this will be a problem on hot sunny days when the surface of a black vehicle will get hot. It would be unfortunate if there wasn’t enough cooling capacity to keep the battery cool and provide enough cooling to the passenger compartment.

  • Tim Dean

    Member
    May 30, 2022 at 5:32 pm

    The cabin tops of all models will be the same color… solar panel color. Don’t worry about the cabin heating or cooling. They have a whole team of engineers and suppliers working on it.

  • Curtis Cibinel

    Member
    May 30, 2022 at 5:41 pm

    The skin cooling is really just the belly pan anyway and since the top of the vehicle (where the solar cells are) is black in all variants heat gained from the sun will likely not vary much different based on colour choice.

  • kerbe2705

    Member
    May 30, 2022 at 11:59 pm

    @David Pastorek – The belly of the Aptera is an aluminum heat sink. See the red circle, below.

    As @Tim Dean said, the upper surfaces of all Apteras will be either black, solar panels or glass.

    Aptera vehicles are air conditioned and heated so the cabin temperature is adjustable.

    When parked in the sun on a hot day the basic solar package will power the flow-through ventilation system to keep the interior of the vehicle at the ambient temperature: No more climbing into a 120° car on a 90° day!

    The battery pack is inside the body shell and is, therefore, somewhat insulated from exterior temperatures. I’m sure, like all EVs, if the pack temperature starts to rise the vehicle will automatically attempt to cool it.

    • Gerald Adams

      Member
      June 18, 2022 at 1:10 pm

      We are in Phoenix, so ambient temperature is often 110+ degf., so blowing air through the system doesn’t really excite me. Anyone know what type of a/c system is to be installed or tested or considered?

      • Alain Chuzel

        Member
        June 19, 2022 at 7:19 am

        Having studied/lived/worked in Phoenix for way more time than I should have, I feel your pain! If you’re interested, it is actually quite remarkable how well blowing 110+ degF air through the system works. As an experiment, during the summer, I would purposefully park my dark red exterior, black cloth interior Saturn Coupe on a black asphalt parking lot facing south with no shade in sight and let it sit all day from about 8 AM to 1 PM then from 1:30 PM to 5 PM. I outfitted a few thermo-couples within the cabin and logged a lot of temperatures. Every other day, I positioned a common 50-watt solar panel on the popped open moon roof and wired it directly to the cars blower motor. The differences in temperature between days with and without the solar were remarkable!

        The A/C in Aptera will be of the common vapor compression cycle variety. More specifically, it’s a non-reversible heat pump.

  • John Trotter

    Member
    June 18, 2022 at 4:17 pm

    Interesting sketch in the recent patent application. Just representational I assume, but a clearer idea than just a circle on the belly pan.

    • Pistonboy Delux

      Member
      June 18, 2022 at 7:55 pm

      This is good informational. I assumed the liquid carrying coil would be over the entire surface of the belly pan. This is a simpler and better arrangement.

  • Steven G. Bueche

    Member
    June 19, 2022 at 3:54 am

    My 2021 M3 can lose as much as 30 miles in a few hours of trying to cool the interior. This is on a 98* day while the setting is on HIGH temp of cooling the interior. That’s above 80* on the inside. Venting the windows doesn’t help.

    Solar panels get hot. Since venting the Aptera’s windows will only release heat from the mid point of the interior it would seem lots of heat would get trapped inside from the mid-arm upwards. Do we leave to leave the hatch cracked open when parked? I suspect that with the gull wing doors most of the heat would be released once you open the door. Is there a way to leave the door windows down and not have anyone get into your car?

    How much range is lost in the 8 hour day while at work? Will the solar charging compensate for it and what solar package is needed to accomplish this in order to have a gain at the end of the day?

    • Oz (It’s Oz, just Oz)

      Member
      June 19, 2022 at 5:19 am

      The plan is for the vehicle to circulate interior/exterior air without using cooling power (Basically powered venting), to allow the cabin to remain at the outside air temperature and avoid the typical vehicle heating from direct sunlight. (The cause for excessive heat in a parked car.) This will be far less power sapping then trying to cool the trapped air, which is what standard A/C entails. This plus the insulation provided by the thick composite walls, should make for a very efficient system.

  • Tim Dean

    Member
    June 19, 2022 at 10:14 am

    I Hope the Aptera engineers are designing the HVAC system to maintain the cabin temp at 70 deg F when 2 people are either parked on asphalt with no air movement across the belly pan when in 120 deg F sun or during a -20 deg F snow storm.

    The Aptera HVAC system needs this capability for traffic accidents, camping & a roadside snooze for as long as the batteries maintain power.

  • James Elliott Elliott

    Member
    June 29, 2022 at 1:00 pm

    Having owned two 1950’s vintage British cars, I am familiar with inadequate cooling when caught in slow traffic. One of the advantages on an EV is that the batteries only heat while being used. My question is, what will cool the battery packs when the car is sitting in a stalled traffic jam in 100F heat and running the heat pump?

    • Riley ________________________________

      Member
      June 29, 2022 at 5:13 pm

      Aptera doesn’t have a heat pump but maybe you mean the air conditioner. There is no official statement i can remember regarding how it will dissipate heat. My guess is the a/c system will be separate from the battery and use its own fan to pull air thru the gaps in the front suspension.

      For the battery, the plan is to use a large metal heatsink located on the belly to keep the battery at ambient. This will work perfectly fine sitting in traffic due to the car not generating any heat.

    • BRUCE MENGLER

      Member
      June 29, 2022 at 6:39 pm

      I’m bored so I’ll contribute to the idle conjecture. In a recent (June 2022) video from Aptera Owners Club showed a photo of the new redesigned motor from Elaphe. It was strikingly different from previous photos in that it showed hollow gaps where metal had previously existed plus it did NOT show any tubing or connections for motor cooling. Also keep in mind that the base Elaphe motor model is/was their M700 (for 70 HP) which Aptera is detuning down to 50 HP. So it very well could be that the production Apteras will use air cooling for the motors. So an Aptera idling in Phoenix in summer won’t need much cooling for the batteries since the Aptera is barely moving. The outboard front wheels would benefit from increased airflow available to them.

      • Oz (It’s Oz, just Oz)

        Member
        June 29, 2022 at 8:01 pm

        Would the enclosed wheel pants interfere with the concept of air cooling the motors?

        • kerbe2705

          Member
          June 29, 2022 at 9:15 pm

          @Oz (It’s Oz, just Oz) At any given moment a part of the motor will be exposed beneath the wheel pants – and the rotating wheel will provide some amount of air movement.

      • kerbe2705

        Member
        June 29, 2022 at 9:32 pm

        @BRUCE MENGLER Remember, it’s only a rendering – that also doesn’t show brake lines or any of the other cabling shown in images of the Beta motor. Aptera is not going to switch from a liquid-cooled to an air-cooled motor.

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