One pedal drivingPosted by richard-blackwood on August 10, 2021 at 4:34 pm
I know the Aptera will have one regenerative braking, but will it have one foot driving as is so common now?
- This discussion was modified 1 year, 3 months ago by Gabriel Kemeny.
- 25 Replies
- MemberAugust 10, 2021 at 5:10 pm
I love it on the BMW i3. Would be great if the Aptera had it.
- MemberAugust 27, 2021 at 5:07 pm
Fully agree on both points.
- MemberAugust 11, 2021 at 7:36 am
From the FAQ page.
“Aptera will offer adjustable levels in 3 or 4 settings, from off to very heavy regen braking.”
I read “very heavy” as one pedal capability
- MemberAugust 11, 2021 at 10:26 am
I believe the optional level 2 autopilot will also have one pedal driving as it would simply be a selection in the software. I’m not so sure about the base car.
- MemberAugust 25, 2021 at 1:04 pm
The regenerative braking that is proportional to the accelerator pedal release. Seems so normal in my old Tesla. Hoping for similar in the Aptera. Yes?
- ModeratorAugust 25, 2021 at 5:37 pm
It may take Elaphe a bit of time to dial it in, but assume similar functionality eventually.
- MemberAugust 27, 2021 at 4:13 pm
if pedals resistance to be pressed to the floor/wall is too less, one can go over bumps or daydream thus end up not energy input vs movement keeping momentum consistent on monotonous roads, which is for efficiency over many iterations, if pedal resistance is too much its more tiring to hold pedal over longer trips. this could be fixed with cruise control assuming the software’s knows when car needs to slow down b/c it cant carry momentum at maybe even a slight turn
if not, there can be a touch on screen (or that modular programable optional switch concept from old forum) to ECU lock pedal input, then when wanting to change speed, the screen will show how much to push the pedal to maintain momentum before signaling that the driver in back in control. this also can be used for switching out of auto pilot type thing.
in old forum, there was version of this that mechanically locked and unlock pedal in place, which would prevent need to be distracted by a screen that’s hard to be careful with enough to modulate the right graphics especially on bumpy ride over bumpy parts of road. it used toothed pulleys and chain and a sliding door lock style pin to lock into side of holes.
- MemberSeptember 6, 2021 at 12:29 pm
Another vote for one pedal driving. All EVs should have this, period. I really like the way it’s done on the Bolt, where you get very strong regen in ‘L’, which is suitable for most deceleration, and then there’s a paddle on the steering wheel you can use to add more, which works beautifully when having to slow going down a steep hill for example. I rarely have to touch the brake pedal in our Bolt and it’s an amazing driving experience.
- MemberSeptember 22, 2021 at 10:38 pm
The weight savings from “One pedal” driving alone, seems like a great efficiency (no master, slaves, discs, calipers, lines and fluid), not to mention amount of energy it would intuitively put back in the battery, the stop on a dime feeling, and not having to worry about brake fade from going down long, steep, hill, but are they tried a true? I like em.
- MemberSeptember 23, 2021 at 12:01 am
Even vehicles that use regen for braking (like Tesla) still have mechanical brakes for emergency stopping. Elaphe has said that their in-wheel motors have the ability to replace mechanical brakes but, so far, no one has seen it happen.
I rather like “blended braking” in which the brake pedal serves in a manner similar to the “full regen” paddle on the Volt and Bolt: Release the accelerator and the vehicle regens, apply pressure to the brake pedal and the amount of regen increases, apply more pressure and the mechanical brakes engage to bring the vehicle to a full stop. Honda has this form of braking nailed: It’s seamless and functions without any feeling of “mushiness” or “jerking”.
- MemberSeptember 23, 2021 at 7:26 am
I thought I would miss blended braking when I moved from the Volt to the Model 3 but I haven’t. The Volt had regen paddles that control the level of regen braking as well as blended braking on the brake pedal. The Model 3 just has really strong regen braking when you lift your foot off of the accelerator and the brake pedal is just the friction brakes. I’ve decided that I like the way Model 3 does it much better. I hardly ever use the brake pedal on the 3 and when I do it’s either a light tap at a stop light (usually not necessary) or because I really have to stop. Tesla kept it simple, they made one pedal driving work so well that you can use it almost all of the time which means that they avoided the complexity of making blended braking work on the brake pedal. The blended brake on the Volt eventually did work but the brakes were the reason that I had my car in the shop several times during my first few months of ownership because it kept throwing brake warning lights. Chevy kept trying to adjust the brakes but the eventual solution was a firmware update. Blended braking is hard to do right and as it turns out it isn’t necessary if you do one pedal driving correctly.
- MemberSeptember 23, 2021 at 11:26 am
I had (3) 2013 Volts and I really liked the blended braking, and I now have a Cadillac ELR which uses the same system, but it added paddles, and turning on the brake lights on heave regen deceleration. On all of my EREVs the brakes were hardly used, and like new even after thousands of miles. As mentioned, you could put the gear shifter into L and it would make the car go into regen when you released the brakes. This works well for one foot driving. Another feature that I really like is if you were in L and had cruise control on and the proximity sensor saw a car coming it would automatically disengage cruise control and your car would slow down. I figured that the Safety Pilot will include these features.
- MemberSeptember 25, 2021 at 9:58 pm
Safety Pilot will have Adaptive Cruise Control – it won’t disengage but it will slow your vehicle to match the speed of any vehicle you’re overtaking, and then accelerate as you pull into the passing lane.
- MemberSeptember 25, 2021 at 8:59 pm
I too have a Volt that I drive in L and use the regen button to get as close to one foot driving as I can. Today I had the opportunity to drive a Model Y and it had some MAJOR one foot capabilities. Unlike my Volt, the Y was able to come to a complete stop by taking my foot off the pedal. I was shown on the configuration screen how the sensitivity/weight of the one foot driving could be adjusted. Very cool feature that I would definitely use in the Aptera. Also, I would think that the ability to STOP using this technology would be easier in the Aptera due to its light weight.
- MemberSeptember 26, 2021 at 1:48 pm
Regen, almost by definition, will result in the ability to one-pedal drive. Heavier regen simply translates to having heavier braking.
The practical implementation of heavy regen braking requires the ability to slow the vehicle without invoking the vehicles anti-lock mechanism.
Regardless of the electric vehicle – all contemporary EVs offer regen – you don’t want it to be so-severe that if you take your foot off the accelerator that your passenger (or even stuff you place on the passenger seat) slammed into the windshield.
Rather you want heavy enough regen to bring your Aptera to a halt from 60 mph in 200-250 feet while a panic stop would stop it in say 110-ft. (Some performance cars have recorded panic stops from 60 mph under 100-ft.).
Most one-pedal driving fans like a little heavier regen than one gets from a Spark EV, Bolt or Volt in “L”. In those circumstances where you’re having to brake hard for a yellow traffic light, you’ll use the regular brake pedal which does involve max regen (I’ve seen my Spark regen up to 60 kw with the brake pedal in such circumstances. If memory serves, the MOST regen I’ve seen with it in “L” is like 40 kw max.)
The cool thing about regen is that by modulating your foot on the accelerator you can actually control the amount of regen (or braking) by how delicately you press the accelerator. If you use standard cruise control (available at speeds >24 mph) you would be surprised how much regen you might get just cruising back roads and residential streets as CC is just that more precise than my heavy foot 😉
- MemberJuly 3, 2022 at 1:03 pm
I haven’t seen any discussion on an e-pedal feature, but I’m hoping Aptera includes it somewhere along their journey. Not only does it fit their efficiency vision, but I really appreciate all the benefits that come with it. Maximizing regeneration braking and trips without ever needing to trigger friction on the brakes leads to brake pad longevity. I have one car with epedal and one without. On the latter, I need to tap on the brake pedal to slow down and I have no idea if I am exceeding the maximum regeneration capability and initiating friction on the pads or not. Epedal takes all of that guesswork out of the equation.
- MemberJuly 3, 2022 at 1:37 pm
Do a little more research on the nature of in-wheel motors and you’ll be in for some good news.
Because of the nature of in-wheel motors – i.e. a very large diameter for the motor’s rotor; the varying dynamics of the way internal power vectors interact, the understanding is that these wheels are capable of more regeneration than more typical in-board motors.
Regen, which is what provides the motor-braking, is adjustable by driving mode and other optional selections using things like the brake pedal but also steering mounted paddles, selector switches for ‘sport’ or what have you, and even, on the ICE imitating gear selector of the Chevy’s; the choice of “Low” range … which is so named because it is like shifting an old hydramatic two-speed automatic in to low gear. It doesn’t accelerate you faster – but its selection will slow you faster with regen. (I have a 90+ percent one-pedal driving style in my Sparky).
You will be pleased when you get it; what the hell is an E-pedal anyway. I’ve not heard the usage which sounds like a proprietary name for one-pedal driving with regen.
- MemberJuly 3, 2022 at 10:48 pm
Personally, I would prefer brake-blended regen to single-pedal. I find it more relaxing to be able to command it to slow down vs command it to speed up. But… I grew up with manual control. Single-pedal is definitely superior to the creep action of automatic transmission.
- MemberJuly 4, 2022 at 9:40 am
@Crissa Kentavr I’m with you: My Honda PHEV has blended braking that seamlessly adjusts between regen and friction as necessary. The harder one presses on the pedal, the more regen one receives. It also has “lift off the accelerator” regen so I feel as if I’m getting the best of both worlds. In addition, the “brake lock” feature does away with “creep”.
- MemberJuly 4, 2022 at 3:05 pm
I think the FAQ page from the old website said there would be some number of levels of regen selectable from the central touch screen.
- MemberJuly 4, 2022 at 3:09 pm
It did, but that is old news. There is no assurance that will be in first production Apterae. We will need to await to see what the final production feature list looks like. Of course may be able to add through over air update after delivery
- This reply was modified 1 year, 4 months ago by Jonah Jorgenson. Reason: corrected spelling
- MemberJuly 9, 2023 at 8:08 am
I am hoping for one pedal driving without the d brakes. I want it to be a deliberate decision to use the friction brakes, not an accident of how hard I press the brake pedal.
- MemberJuly 9, 2023 at 12:58 pm
I am sure that Aptera will max out its regen capability before it starts applying the binders. If you are decelerating hard enough to use the binders on a regular basis then you are driving the vehicle far from optimally anyway, so why would you care where your stand-on-the-nose deceleration comes from???
- This reply was modified 4 months, 1 week ago by J.P. Morere.
- MemberJuly 9, 2023 at 9:44 pm
One foot driving is common in the US, if you are refering to not having to press a clutch peddel. However one peddel driving is not yet common.
Except for the launch mode, Aptera will have one foot driving.
- MemberJuly 12, 2023 at 7:03 am
I’ve heard it will be driver configurable. My Arcimoto has a tactile regen “trigger”, nothing like it on the road. It’s not like a caliper brake you squeeze, it’s a little hook for your trigger finger. Quite fun in a handlebar setup, on a tadpole EV.
That being said, my brothers Model 3 with it’s one pedal driving, is likely to be more effecient than my Arcimoto. Just not as fun.
I’m expecting the Aptera to be something different, happy it will be configurable.
- This reply was modified 4 months ago by Glenn Langit.