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All about the Tesla plug and charging
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All about the Tesla plug and charging
Rolf Brakvatne updated 1 year ago 35 Members · 56 Replies
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Tesla has begun selling its CCS adapter in the US – but only to those Tesla owners who have vehicles that can accept it. It seems that Teslas built before 2020 will need some sort of electronic retrofit for the adapter to function properly. https://electrek.co/2022/09/21/tesla-ccs-adapter-access-public-chargers/
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Biggest thing for me is moving from J1772 to Tesla plug – At least around here, there are a *LOT* more J1772/CCS1 chargers then Tesla – and they are the only ones free at malls / gov. buildings. A CCS to tesla adaptor and agreement with Tesla as they open their network seems to make a lot more sense to me then the other way round – and that presumes they *CAN* get access to the Tesla network.. what if they don’t, or it’s ridicules expensive? Have to use *always* use an adapter to public charge?
Not to mention it’s what is already in my garage for my i3…
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This reply was modified 1 year, 6 months ago by Mark Brandon.
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This reply was modified 1 year, 6 months ago by
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Anyone else dreading having to use a dongle to fast charge? I don’t want to give Tesla any money so I’m not sure what my options will be for CCS fast charging. I think the likely hood of Tesla opening their charging network isn’t very high anyway. Plus, I fear they would charge outrageous prices ($1+ / kwh) during peak times.
Are the folks at Aptera dead set on using the Tesla plug? I agree it has a better form factor, but the country to moving towards CCS. Every single EV available in America, save the Teslas and Leafs, comes with CCS. EA and Francis Energy are plentiful in my region but there are fewer Tesla chargers. It just seems silly to me.
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Hopefully Aptera will support CCS adapters (just like modern Teslas). Here is an adapter (Tesla will only sell theirs to Tesla owners).
FYI: This adapter is “dumb” and is just a pin converter. As demand increases more vendors will pop up.
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Absolutely agree on all points made. I don’t want to be subject to Tesla’s world and trapped into their fees. I’m starting to slowly accept that the CCS plug might just be too large for the space they are trying to work with. I’m hoping we won’t need to dongle our fast charging, but as long as we can use the CCS network, I’ll begrudgingly do it. There better be a place to store it if that is what we need to do. I would so much rather they just design it for CCS. Tesla will eventually need to grabble with this problem as they are in Europe. Tesla will not be enjoying the first mover advantages for that much longer as new, capable EVs are starting to hit the market. Why fight the trend?
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It would greatly appreciated to see a video that shows any of the Aptera prototype vehicles being charged at the Telsa site at the La Costa shopping center less than 5 miles south of the Aptera assembly building
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@BRUCE MENGLER So far as we know, there isn’t yet an Aptera that can accept DC fast charging. Tesla has also not yet opened its Supercharger network in the US to non-Tesla vehicles. You may need to wait a bit for such video to be created…
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The charging receptacle and equipment will be made by Lectron:
“San Diego, CA, November 30, 2022 — Solar electric vehicle (sEV) maker Aptera Motors has announced it will integrate the newly opened North American Charging Standard or NACS (formerly the Tesla connector) into its ultra-efficient vehicles. The NACS charging inlet and EV charging equipment will be built by Lectron, an industry leader dedicated to the widespread adoption of sustainable transportation.”
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Does Lectron make adapters so J1772/CCS2 chargers can be used in a pinch?
Update: I just checked their website and they do make adapters but only sell them to owners of Tesla currently.
Update 2: I sent them an email asking if they plan on opening sales of the adapter to Aptera owners and also suggested it would be nice if their agreement with Aptera included an adapter for each NACS connector.
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This reply was modified 1 year, 4 months ago by
Dennis Swaney.
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This reply was modified 1 year, 4 months ago by
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Thanks Dennis for doing this. There are many of us that will need the adapter. I appreciate the follow through also.🧐 Since APTERA has a deal with Tesla in place, APTERA should sell us the adapter, not just for the convenience but for their potential to profit from it.
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This reply was modified 1 year, 4 months ago by
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It looks like Tesla is going to open their charging stations to non-Tesla vehicles.
There is no formal signature on the dotted line so things can change and be delayed, but it is a positive sign. I never liked the CCS connector(s), but I was resigned to it. This is good news, indeed.
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> “I never liked the CCS connector(s), but I was resigned to it.”
I believe that Tesla are planning to add CCS connectors to the superchargers to fulfil these requirements (so a given supercharger will have both types of connector available on it). For them, it’s a simple change (the new NACS design is actually based on the CCS protocol, not the old Tesla protocol, so all that needs to be changed is the physical connector).
What is not clear is whether the Aptera will have to use a CCS adaptor to charge at the supercharger, or whether they will be able to use the Tesla plug. The Tesla website says that non-Tesla vehicles have to use the CCS cable, but maybe that might change.
https://www.tesla.com/en_gb/support/non-tesla-supercharging> Do supercharger posts support all connector types?
>This pilot is only accessible for CCS-enabled vehicles. If a Supercharger post has two cables, non-Tesla cars can only charge with the CCS connector. Tesla is unable to accommodate vehicles that do not fully comply with CCS communication and safety protocols. If you encounter any issues while charging your vehicle, reach out to Tesla Customer Support or your vehicle manufacturer.
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Based on latest news, Tesla is opening “a portion” of their superchargers. My guess, based on no specific knowledge, is that Version 1 and Version 2 Superchargers may remain NACS-only, while Version 3 (& 4 eventually), will be built/modified to have their dual CCS/NACS cable ends.. That’s hardware. As for customer-side software, everyone will need to use the Tesla app or website. No screens etc on the stations themselves. Ideally, connection will be as seamless as it is for Teslas today: the charger recognizes the car and an associated credit card. Plug and play.
NACS plugs good on any Supercharger. CCS plugs good on CCS/NACS Superchargers. And, CCS cars with adaptors to NACS usable on any Supercharger.
I am sure Tesla will create a cost structure that makes the company serious money, so there will be an incentive to make as many chargers as possible usable by as many users as possible. If they can make the customer-experience as painless as it is with Tesla cars, their share of the charging market will be MORE than their share of BEVs. The complex, unreliable competitors will evaporate.
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Aptera posted this on its social feeds yesterday:
“Tesla is opening up their Supercharger network, and Aptera owners will have access to the number one charging network in North America”
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The Tesla CCS1 adapter has dropped in price to $175, although you may need to own a compatible Tesla vehicle to buy one, not sure. I picked one up for my Model Y.
We will definitely need one of these to charge at a non supercharger location, and possibly at the supercharger as well depending on how it all shakes out.
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Now that “non Tesla” connections exist at Superchargers, I wonder how it will work for Aptera. The Tesla app causes the CCS adaptor to be the cable end if “non Tesla” is chosen. Will Aptera be able to just check in like my Tesla, or, as a “non Tesla”, will we need a CCS adaptor? And, will we need the $12.99 monthly subscription to get decent electric rates? We have a year to figure it out, but …
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There is absolutely no reason to assume that an Aptera will charge any differently than a Tesla. It has the NACS port and it will implement the Tesla protocol, it should be plug and play. The Magic Dock is for cars with a CCS port, those cars implement the CCS communication protocol as well has having a CCS plug, that’s not true for Aptera which has native Tesla support. Unless Aptera tells us differently should assume that you’ll be able to plug an Aptera directly into any Tesla Supercharger.
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I am From MO. I will believe plug and play between Aptera and Tesla super chargers when it is explicitly confirmed with detail procedures and costs specified in an official announcement from one or both of the manufacturers.
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One other interesting comment made in the Investor Day presentation is that Tesla’s new 4th gen Supercharger posts will have longer charging cables to make it easier to reach charge ports in various locations on different EVs. I’ll be very interested to see just how long the gen 4 cables are and how they do cable management, since the cables would have to be a lot longer than they are currently to be able to charge all EVs.
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Given there is lots of investor support from outside the US, and we can therefore expect early roll out in Europe at least, where even Tesla does not use the Tesla plug/NACS I would be interested in what the plans for plugs in OS markets will be.
I am still hoping for 3 phase 22kw 230v in a Type 2 plug with tesla style pin reuse and a CCS2 adapter like the early Europe X/S had.
https://www.electrive.com/2019/05/08/tesla-presents-ccs-adapters-for-model-s-x/
This although desirable from a user point of view is probably unlikely from an engineering standpoint as all the custom charging electronics are likely to be developed for single phase only. Even if limited to 7kw 32Amp single phase a type 2 plug is going to be essential in most non US markets. My measurements of photos suggest even a CCS2 wont fit in the packaging for aptera so some sort of adapter will be essential. The tesla solution would be ideal, but it’s not included in the NACS opening up so may be complicated.
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In St. Moritz Chris Anthony told me that the Aptera for Europe will feature the CCS2 socket DC-Mid (see attached picture here), except those early deliveries of the AccelerateAptera program which will have to use an adapter.
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Interesting. If I’m interpreting this correctly it would mean two things for the eventual (correct me if I’m wrong):
- AC charging in europe will not see the benefits of 3 phase AC for Aptera (not a big problem since the inverter probably isn’t big enough to benefit)
- All DCFC will require a DC-Mid to DC-High adapter (which currently doesn’t seem to exist) since I cant find anything about chargers or other cars directly using DC-Mid. Seems like a standard noone used.
Edit: Did some research and Tesla used to have a “modified type 2” plug for europe for model s/x prior to 2019 and blocked 3rd party adapters. Again I cant seem to find whatever adapter would be needed for DCFC in europe to use ccs 2 DC-Mid
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If Tesla does not agree to have Aptera charge in their stations, what are the alternatives? A CSS adaptor?
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@miguel-podolsky There appear to be two options: 1) Tesla modifies their app to allow non-Tesla drivers to select “release CCS adapter” or “use NACS connector” or, 2) Aptera drivers will need to insert a CCS adapter into their NACS port, then connect the Magic Dock CCS adapter to it.
Although some seem to feel that Tesla will magnanimously include Aptera into its Supercharger system as if Aptera vehicles were Tesla vehicles (with plug-&-charge capability) I think that’s highly unlikely.
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Was Tesla’s interest in widening SuperCharger access a flash in the pan?
Possibly, enabling non-Teslas to charge wasn’t just a way to be eligible for government funding, and other EVs will still be allowed to use SuperChargers. Nevertheless it would be ironic if it worked out that California was the one jurisdiction where Aptera owners couldn’t use Tesla chargers.
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People won’t be locked out due to Tesla not joining the common payment system, unless they choose to lock themselves out. Anyone can still register with the Tesla app and pay that way.
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Is our vehicle going to “Plug and Charge” at Tesla sites?
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YES after you create an account with Tesla & use their app to activate the charger
