The Downside Side of Tech?

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions The Downside Side of Tech?

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions The Downside Side of Tech?

  • The Downside Side of Tech?

     V Pilot updated 7 months, 3 weeks ago 16 Members · 24 Posts
  • Ray Holan

    October 28, 2021 at 9:37 am

    The posts in the “What Options Do You Want…” thread seems to break us into several camps.

    •Those who would prefer a good deal of tech, like self-driving and otherwise, in their Apterae.

    •Those who would prefer almost no extra tech (e.g. ditch the audio system, electric seats)

    •Those OK with any tech options as long as they don’t delay production of the first Apterae.

    I came across this somewhat tongue in cheek article re: tech in newer vehicles that some of you in the Aptera waiting line with me might enjoy….

  • John Malcom

    October 28, 2021 at 10:57 am

    I certainly fall into the third category. Not because I wouldn’t like some additions or changes (Probably not popular enough to add to the marketability of the vehicle) but because I have been there and done that with trying to get a startup product into a tight market.

    I have an adopted son. he recently graduated from Westpoint and was commissioned an Armor Officer. At the armor school they of course learn about tanks. He was complaining to an instructor about what he thought was wrong with the M1A1tank and what he thought needed to be changed to make it better. The wise older, experienced Sergeant looked at him and said “Son, if you waited for the perfect tank to come along you would not only lose the battle, but the war”.

    Translated into Aptera speak, If you don’t get product into the market place soonest, you will lose your competitive advantage and jeopardize the viability of the future of the company.

    The Aptera is revolutionary as it is. Get it out and let other people see it. Win the first battle in the market place then improve it to win the war

    • Ray Holan

      October 28, 2021 at 3:31 pm

      Nothing like a good story to get the point across. Thanks for passing that one along, John.

    • Ron Ledohowski

      November 7, 2021 at 6:13 pm

      I’m going to strongly disagree on a bunch of things. On the surface, makes for a great story.

      We apparently are on opposite sides of life. That said, I find it hard at times to bite my tongue on some things.


      I have edited down a recent video, which I’ve posted in “totality” elsewhere, to further my repeated point & stated opinion.

      What is a “technocrat”?:

      BONUS: It also includes a clear definition of “Luddite” (also non-directed, of course) TOO. Worth the watch.

      Sandy Munro (video & excerpts) is dead on:

  • Ronald Miller

    October 28, 2021 at 11:01 am

    With you 100% John. Fit, finish, function all needs to be there but bells and whistles that would delay production should be put on the back burner.

    • John Malcom

      October 28, 2021 at 11:42 am

      Absolutely right Ron! Done in so few words. I need to take the hint from your succinct posts

  • Joel Smith

    October 28, 2021 at 11:04 am

    “Nothing about this car pisses me off” Sounds like something Sandy Munro would say (or at least you would hope he’d say about your product). I look forward to seeing that that good sense comes thru with his input into the Aptera production process.

    • John Malcom

      October 28, 2021 at 11:41 am

      Great post! summarizes everything in a few words.

      • Lou Verner

        October 28, 2021 at 12:17 pm

        Totally agree! Thanks for posting Ray!

  • Wesley Roeder

    October 28, 2021 at 1:01 pm

    I completely agree. Start with the sentiment: “nothing about this car pisses me off” and work from there.

    I have had a dozen Citroen 2CVs — very stark, do nothing for you, and you can’t really be aggravated by them. At the other end of the spectrum I briefly owned a 2021 Corvette this year which was full of magnificent engineering but managed to annoy me every time I got in it. So I sold it.

    I think it’s ok to be missing a few features, but not ok to have features you don’t want that you can’t turn off.

  • Charles Kaneb

    October 29, 2021 at 9:57 pm

    I think the distribution of what options people want is bimodal.

    There should be a base model – the plainest vehicle on the road – FM stereo with AUX jack, three-dial A/C, dumb cruise control, manual steering, manual doors, manual seats with a fixed back angle. Make mine bright green.

    There should be a loaded model – automatic emergency braking, lane-keep assist, active cruise control, heads-up display, CarPlay or Android Auto depending on who gives the better deal, automatic HVAC, power recline and lumbar seats.

    That way the number of configurations for the electronics is cut down considerably – no other combinations of options have to be developed and tested to work together.

    It’s likely that there’ll be a couple of items that get included on the base model just to get good prices from suppliers. If Aptera uses the Tesla Supercharger system it’s likely to have a factory navigation system for trip and stop planning.

    • Curtis Cibinel

      October 29, 2021 at 10:26 pm

      As they already said in interviews that the 400 mile is the most common choice it would seem a mid tier loadout is the most common. As a result the bimodal option assumption would appear disproved. If the logistics of their assembly process avoid issues from the options then no reason to limit choice.

    • V Pilot

      November 9, 2021 at 7:25 pm

      I’m with Charles here. Not everyone is on the same technological level. To alienate those that are less technologically inclined or to preclude them from enjoying or participating in reducing climate change, which this vehicle does, is a mistake. There are plenty of people out there that are not addicted to their phones or other high tech. 40+ years of using standard vehicle controls becomes no look, second nature…old habits die hard. Make mine Silver

      • Ray Holan

        November 10, 2021 at 5:04 am

        Ken, I second your point about not all of us being on the same technological level. I was a database design consultant for 30+ years, yet I’m still flummoxed by the behavior of Apple CarPlay when I connect my iPhone to my car! Anymore, for me the simpler the better. Yet I wouldn’t begrudge my fellow Geeks wanting heads up displays, self-driving, or other options.

        • V Pilot

          November 10, 2021 at 7:25 am

          Yeah, not my intention to begrudge anyone, just to include everyone. To those tech geeks…more power to ya! I worked in the scientific field but that was more than 10 years ago, so I’ve slipped more than a bit. Grabbing the early adopters is key but so is attracting the masses. I watch CA efforts as I live in NY which seems to follow pretty closely. Small ICE engine phase out by 2024 and cars by 2035(targets)…but ponder the numbers

  • kerbe2705

    October 29, 2021 at 10:37 pm

    Reading through this thread it seems that some of the responders are under the impression that the various systems they think will delay production are hardware-based: They aren’t – it’s all software. In some cases, folks are suggesting that hardware be ADDED to replace or replicate software-based systems.

    Think about it: Aptera’s “audio system” will be an amplifier and some speakers. There’s no “head unit” – no radio, no disc player, nada. You want to listen to music, you connect your phone via Bluetooth. Navigation is just software. Adaptive Cruise Control is just software. The HVAC controls are just software – no physical switches or wiring required.

    Heating and cooling the seats is a TERRIFIC way to save energy: Blowing hot or cool air around the cabin can lessen range at an alarming rate.

    Aptera has no plans to offer “self driving”: They’re offering a Level 2 package as an option to NOT having driver safety assistance software.

  • Philip Raymond

    October 29, 2021 at 11:59 pm

    Of all of the volumes of stories and information John has shared with us, this tank story for me, is the best! It crystallized the Aptera mission.

    • Ray Holan

      October 30, 2021 at 5:14 am

      I completely agree, Phillip. Tanks a lot, John.

  • my_discord_number_is_0328 bloody stupid

    November 7, 2021 at 8:21 pm

    wireless key has been hacked into before by intercepting password as user was pressing buttons on the key. not so easy to steal somones toyota style keys with their electric code in key transmitted by conduction in case key was clay copied.

    in crash, electronics fail, so door locks suck especially if glass cant be broken if its the aircraft poly plastic (a strong material not chinese toy plastic) that was considered to be applied. mechanical sliding door style lock is enough, not even a need for spring replacement after wearing over time (consider G forces moving parts). i had a nice design including key lock , areo smooth exterior, pulling rope and lock inside instead of lever. too bad i forgot it but it can be found in old forum, by searching with teh username with the word “discord” in it

    thought experiment: if self driving is claimed to need driver attention just in case it fails, yet it seems to not need it, it can keep people distracted with other tasks from being ready as already happens to a lesser extent in teslas. wouldn’t be surprised if they took pay to drive someone to death after identifying model number associated with owner, then blaming driver incompetency. people could live record driving so proof for accountiblity can happen, but whos going to store all the data? google drive i guess, besides personal storage.

    • John Trotter

      November 7, 2021 at 8:33 pm

      Fortunately, modern failure modes and effects analysis is way more reliable than “in crash, electronics fail”. Let the engineers use their FEMA.

  • Russell Fauver

    November 8, 2021 at 9:34 pm

    I’m in the minimalist camp. If it’s not on there or in there then you don’t have to pay for it or repair it. Keep it simple.

    • Ray Holan

      November 9, 2021 at 5:53 am


  • Riley ________________________________

    November 9, 2021 at 4:29 am

    I started the “what options do you want” because i am in the right to repair camp. I agree with the viewpoints on all sides and as long as aptera upholds it’s promise of supplying the world with an easy to repair and owner upgradable vehicle everyone wins. I’ve gotten dozens of ideas for options I will be adding to my aptera myself.

    • Ray Holan

      November 9, 2021 at 5:55 am

      Glad you started the “what options do you want” thread. It’s generated a boatload of good ideas.

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