Deal breaker that might keep you from buying?

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions Deal breaker that might keep you from buying?

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions Deal breaker that might keep you from buying?

  • Deal breaker that might keep you from buying?

     Kevin Bradbury updated 2 months ago 132 Members · 321 Posts
  • Mark Steinback

    Member
    February 27, 2022 at 2:10 pm

    As we get closer to seeing a finished Aptera product, we see things either added or taken away that may affect whether we will ultimately want the vehicle.

    Not having some form of blind spot/lane change warning because of the large pillars between the side and rear windows affecting side vision raises a safety red flag to me and might be a deal breaker. I have not seen any confirmation whether or not they will have this feature.

    Also, the talk of maybe not having side cameras (with or without mirrors) concerns me. The Aptera is a futuristic high tech vehicle and not having the cameras makes it much more mundane and possibly less safe.

    What, if any, are your possible deal breakers?

    • This discussion was modified 8 months, 1 week ago by  bbelcamino.
  • Curtis Cibinel

    Member
    February 27, 2022 at 2:29 pm

    Unfortunately a deal breaker for some might be regulation stupidity in some areas that is completely outside of the companies control. Europe has the issues around classification being over 2m wide. It also appears that really stupid rules require a helmet (ie ontario) or motorcycle license (ie alberta). I’m not sure what states have issues but I seem to recall someone saying 3 states need motorcycle licenses.

    I can definitely think of things I’d like to see but none are deal breakers for me; kinda hoping some might be added over time as they iterate / refine during production. These include:

    – A wheel (seriously why with the two tone ugly yoke in the new renders – fail on functionality and design….)
    – Non wrapped finish
    – LFP Batteries
    – Heat Pump
    – Trailer Hitch (Light Duty)
    – Tesla Plug / Charger Network

    • V Pilot

      Member
      February 27, 2022 at 5:21 pm

      The yoke vs wheel has been discussed before. I’m with Curtis though on this one, maybe not a deal breaker but definitely would prefer a wheel or combo wheel/yoke. Could do a yoke if it was 180 degrees lock to lock. Surely the supplier of this part can make all three choices without issue and leave it to the buyer to choose when your time comes to finalize purchase. I also don’t care for the wrap. I would have it painted when the wrap would need to be replaced.

      • This reply was modified 9 months ago by  V Pilot.
      • Nathan Hubbard

        Member
        February 28, 2022 at 2:52 pm

        I’m ok with the yoke, as long as it’s an option I don’t have to opt for.

        Otherwise forget it. I’ve used one before. No.

        • Shaun Gentry Gentry

          Member
          April 6, 2022 at 9:48 pm

          You’re okay with a yoke if it’s forced on you but otherwise not? I am not sure I understood you correctly but if I did I am struggling to make sense of this rationale 😄

    • Vernon Sinnott

      Member
      July 28, 2022 at 3:49 pm

      Alberta currently requires both a motorcycle license and the wearing of helmets. They need to change ligislation to recognize the autocycle as seperate from motorcycles.

    • DIRK WRIGHT

      Member
      August 20, 2022 at 10:47 am

      These are just my personal opinions. They are neither right nor wrong.

      The yoke is a safety feature. I support the idea, particularly since I am tall, and I’m fed up with steering wheels interfering with me seeing the dash instruments.

      I would much rather have paint since that can be repaired whereas repairing a wrap I think is very hard.

      I don’t care what batteries they use, as long as they work.

      I think a heat pump is a good choice because of efficiency, but they are heavier than resistance heating. I don’t know about cooling though.

      No trailer hitch. It doesn’t make sense to me.

      Obviously, the Tesla plug (can we call it something else?) is best.

      For me, a deal breaker would be them raising the price by $10,000 because of: pick one or more: inflation, supply chain problems, design changes, or “just because.” When we reserved our cars, we did not sign a contract for the price. They are not required to meet any price point at all. To me, it’s just wild speculation on their part to name a price range, since they want to attract as many people as possible.

  • Jon Arryn

    Member
    February 27, 2022 at 2:48 pm

    For me, a vinyl wrapped finish is a deal breaker. I live in the desert southwest where 3M does not warranty their vinyl wrap product for any amount of time. I question then how Aptera expects that finish to last ten years, but I understand that’s not location specific. From firsthand experience with 3M wraps, the product expectancy was about 3-4 years in the desert southwest.. That was with a vehicle that was primarily garaged. It’s not just direct sunlight, but that dry heat is not kind to such a finish. My ex-Pony was babied with hand washing and applying UV wrap protectant products. I can only imagine if I primarily charged the Aptera with solar, that wrap life expectancy would be even less than what i’ve experienced.

    Not deal breakers, but that new yoke in the render does not make me smile. I’m sure for some it complements the Aptera’s futuristic look, but I prefer a more practical and safer traditional wheel. Makes me sad there won’t be Android Auto/Apple CarPlay support, but I suppose I could make do with Bluetooth audio. Google Maps or Waze rocks though. Will definitely miss that capability.

    In the bonus category, being it’s licensed as a motorcycle in Arizona, I would be able to drive in the HOV Lanes at any time.

  • Joshua Rosen

    Member
    February 27, 2022 at 2:49 pm

    As Curtis mentioned regulation is a potential show stopper for me. MA requires a Class M license for an autocycle. There is a bill in the MA legislature to fix this but it’s been moving at glacial speed.

    The deal breaker for me that the company is in control of is the 3.3KW charger. I’ve reserved a 60KWh version, hopefully they will put a proper charger into the 60KWh and 100KWh versions but if they don’t I’ll wait until they do. A 16 hour 10-90 charge time is absolutely unacceptable. I’m also very unhappy with the 50KW DC charging but I think I can live without this as long as I can do overnight charging. The range of the car is so great that I think all DC charging can be avoided as long as you can get a full charge overnight which you could do with 6.6KW but not with 3.3KW.

    The thing I’m disappointed in is the lack of Android Auto. I think rolling their own UI is a bad mistake when they could have started with a solid foundation if they had used Android Automotive. Failing to do that they should have supported AA and Car Play. I’m reserving judgement on this until I see the car and can evaluate the nav system that they’ve included.

    • Steve Wanamaker

      Member
      August 26, 2022 at 9:35 am

      I have to agree on the charger. For me the Aptera is all about freedom. I’m thinking of road trips with the 600 mi version where I charge only overnight at camp sites with 14-50 220v. This would completely eliminate the hassle of finding/using fast charging. This goes out the window without the 6.6KW onboard charger.

  • Bob Kirchner

    Member
    February 27, 2022 at 3:39 pm

    I find myself having an “old man yells at cloud” moment about the steering yoke depicted in the Beta renders. As if the original proposal to borrow the quartic steering wheel from a 1973 Austin Allegro wasn’t bad enough, now they’ve decided to try to impress Elon Musk with a copycat yoke. It won’t work. He’s already expressed his disdain for “science-project weirdmobiles”.

    Unless someone can convince me of some essential advantage to a yoke, or tiller, or joystick, or whatever, it just seems to me to be the sort of “designer’s ego over function” which has no place on a vehicle whose mission is efficiency.

    I know I won’t want to have to countersteer on ice with a yoke, and since that’s not a rare occurrence for me, if they don’t at least offer the option of a round, or nearly so, steering wheel, I’m out. What’s worse, I fear it could antagonise other potential buyers.

    Now if you’ll excuse me, there’s a stratocumulus up there that needs to be told a thing or two.

    • Doug Porter

      Member
      February 28, 2022 at 7:50 am

      I’m not a fan of yokes but we’ve had a Honda Odyssey for years where the steering wheel blocks my view of the speedometer. Rather than put the wheel at a height where I don’t want it I mounted my phone to the side and use a GPS speedometer app on it, which works just fine.

      If there was a yoke, I could see the speedometer.

      Now, in our old Prius they had the speedo mounted higher on the dash and the wheel did not interfere at all, so there are clearly ways around it. I have no problem with the Tesla solution of putting the speed in the top left of the center display (which is effectively where my cell phone speedometer workaround is in the Odyssey). But the yoke is another way around it.

      I don’t want it, but it does not strike me as being designer ego based.

      • Bob Kirchner

        Member
        March 2, 2022 at 2:23 pm

        I characterise it ad designer ego based because it solves no problem. You had a Honda with a badly designed instrument panel. The obvious solution is to design a better instrument panel, rather than to “reinvent the wheel” so to speak.

      • DIRK WRIGHT

        Member
        August 20, 2022 at 10:51 am

        Yeah, I agree. I’m tall and the steering wheel blocks the instruments no matter which car I drive. I’m very happy to have a yoke.

        I don’t understand why Aptera would want to impress Musk. He’s an asshole so why bother? His cars are exceptionally boring so, nah, I will never buy one. Musk is just jealous that he didn’t think of the Aptera first. This is how psychopaths like him show jealousy, they disdain other people’s ideas.

        • LoveAptera YokeDealbreaker

          Member
          August 29, 2022 at 3:04 pm

          Dirk, I agree with everything you said (except liking an airplane yoke, even though I’m also tall), and Tesla cars are a LOT of negative things, but….. boring!? How on Earth do you find them boring? You’ve driven one, right? (Tesla has free test drives frequently at Superchargers.)

    • LoveAptera YokeDealbreaker

      Member
      August 29, 2022 at 3:01 pm

      Agree. I was so excited about my Aptera order, it even showed me interior pictures with a steering wheel while I was entering my credit card info. Then a week later I got an email about Gamma, saw the yoke, asked customer service, and was told no, nobody is going to get a safe comfortable steering wheel, not even an option.

      Dealbreaker. I like being alive, and not hitting other people and objects, so I told them to cancel my order.

      And yes, I have driven a yoke, Tesla Model S Plaid. Yoke steering was a complete failure, the removal of all control stalks made it even worse, I then canceled my Plaid order.

  • Gary Greenway

    Member
    February 27, 2022 at 5:54 pm

    I will not allow a camera to watch every move I make or a microphone to record every sound I utter. If that means no self driving mode, I’m OK with that.

    • Efrain Goody

      Member
      March 20, 2022 at 4:14 pm

      Same. I really hate any system that needs to monitor my face, voice, or location in order to function.

    • DIRK WRIGHT

      Member
      August 20, 2022 at 10:52 am

      I would much rather have the car lean into turns than to have self-driving. I have no use for self-driving, and I think it’s dangerous and expensive. Aptera needs to stop following Tesla.

    • Edward Odenkirchen

      Member
      August 25, 2022 at 12:05 pm

      I am in agreement

    • LoveAptera YokeDealbreaker

      Member
      August 29, 2022 at 3:08 pm

      Agree. Will not tolerate. Cruise control is simply good enough.

  • John Malcom

    Member
    February 27, 2022 at 8:48 pm

    I can not think of a deal breaker for me. My interest in Aptera is engineered efficiency. The vehicle as currently constituted satisfies that need. Most of the deal breakers listed in this thread are feature or design based. The shape of the steering device, the capacity of the charger, the external finish, etc. Certainly only a personal opinion, but it seems like “missing the forest for a tree”. All require an adaption or getting use to something new. If we stopped doing that there would be no progress in the world and for me, a dull life. But, fortunately, in this country, to each his own.

    My great grandfather gave up the reins To control the horses for his buggy for a wheel, some pedals, and a stick that protrudes up from the floor. Aptera requires far less adaption for a much bigger payoff.

    • Jon Arryn

      Member
      February 28, 2022 at 4:33 am

      How does the inclusion of a yoke on the beta render indicate engineered efficiency? https://www.consumerreports.org/cars-driving/tesla-steering-yoke-little-benefit-potential-safety-pitfalls-a1034204120/ It’s great that the Aptera for you has no deal breakers. No need to be condescending, nor reply in this thread then. This topic is not for you.

      • John Malcom

        Member
        February 28, 2022 at 8:38 am

        My apologies. Did not mean to sound condescending. Sorry I offended you. The yoke is a feature in a beta render. If it survives into production, an irritant but does not detract from the performance efficiency of the vehicle. (Power train efficiency)

        In any case I trust Aptera engineers to do the right thing for the majority of owners. Overall it is a remarkable vehicle.

        I hadn’t noticed this until after I posted the note you responded to. In the beta test of suspension the beta test vehicle had a steering wheel that was used vigorously during the moose test.

        • Shaun Gentry Gentry

          Member
          April 6, 2022 at 10:08 pm

          Engineers are not always designers (for good reason) – they are engineers. I don’t expect engineers to be fully versed in automotive safety or to fully understand what situation calls for a wheel and what situation calls for a yoke but there are specific situations that call for one or the other. There is a reason why virtually all passenger motor vehicles use a steering wheel and why Tesla’s implementation of a yoke in their own vehicle has been widely criticized by many (and if Tesla is being criticized for it you had best bet that a smaller startup without the same sized overly zealous fanbase will be too).

          • LoveAptera YokeDealbreaker

            Member
            August 29, 2022 at 3:11 pm

            And Tesla has lost hordes of orders because of the yoke, the Model S Plaid is much lower in sales than previous model years. Now that Lucid and other manufactures are meeting and surpassing Tesla in safety, performance, comfort, reliability, and customer service, Tesla needs to tread carefully if they want to avoid extinction.

            • Richard Palmisano

              Member
              September 8, 2022 at 9:56 am

              Yeah…the competition is still coming..all over themselves honestly.

            • Robert Horton II

              Member
              September 27, 2022 at 5:41 pm

              Hey, they still have that “bulletproof” Cyber Truck to save the day (eventually).

              I think yokes look really neat and with FSD, I imagine one wouldn’t need to finagle with them much.

        • Sam Adams

          Member
          July 28, 2022 at 7:03 am

          I wonder if the moose test was tried with a yoke.

      • Jonah Jorgenson

        Member
        September 29, 2022 at 2:21 pm

        Wow, talk about condescending. Actually, any topic is for anyone to comment on in the forum. I think only the official moderators can determine if a comment is not appropriate for a particular topic/thread.

        At least John Malcom apologized for any offense taken by you😉

        Following the gamma reveal, we know that the yoke will be the steering device in the production Aptera. It is time to put this issue to bed without additional angst on either side.

    • Bob Kirchner

      Member
      March 2, 2022 at 2:27 pm

      Cars have steering wheels instead of reins because steering wheels function well with mechanical steering in a way which reins don’t.

      Some argue that yokes are better for self driving cars, but self driving cars don’t exist yet. Putting a yoke on a car today is like trying to steer a horse with a steering wheel in 1890 because we would be switching to cars in a few decades.

      I have issues with other user interface choices in the design, mostly related to touch screen control of functions which could be operated with less distraction if there were switches. But I can accept those choices because they allow cheaper manufacturing, and therefore may be essential to the success of the “project”. I don’t see any way in which making the inferior choice of a yoke would be beneficial to anyone, much less essential, and so it puts the other choices in a different light for me.

      If I were to become an Aptera owner in the future, I could see myself frequently being called upon to “explain” my vehicle. I could promote the primacy of efficiency in its design. I could explain the reason behind the weird shape. I could explain the three wheels.

      But I could never explain or defend a yoke. I’d just be embarrassed. And I don’t embarrass easily.

  • Steven G. Bueche

    Member
    February 28, 2022 at 3:58 am

    I think the term Deal Breaker doesn’t apply to me.

    I think the term Adaptive Frustration does. Let me explain.

    Unless I designed a car to my every need, every car requires adaption. I’m 5’7″ and nothing seems to fit me except my 96 Cherokee. The model 3 is close because most things are adjustable and with the touch of the memory buttons all settings are brought to me from my wife’s 5′ 11″ frame.

    The only design of this car that may require adaptation for me as well would be the side window middle line of sight bar which makes me feel like I’ll be bobbing my head up and down to see past it. A safety concern for visual reasons.

    <font face=”inherit”>Most of the other concerns I read here are a non issue for me. I don’t need a rolling office, sound studio, media center or the latest tech to drive or </font>appreciate<font face=”inherit”> it. When I drive, I’m a driver. </font>

    <font face=”inherit”>John makes a great point for the blind spot indicators again, for </font>safety<font face=”inherit”> reasons. </font>

    <font face=”inherit”>I’d add to this Sun Visors. I’ve yet to see any in any snap shot. A reply of the Face Book page says they’re working on it but it seems a bit long in development for this to still be an issue. I would have thought the interior design guy would have been all over this on. And what’s the deal with the </font>Velcro<font face=”inherit”> flap glove box?</font>

    <font face=”inherit”>I live in the southern east part of the country and yes wraps don’t last long down here as well but at the first sign of </font>degradation<font face=”inherit”> I’ll heat gun, peel and paint the car. I’m using the paint protection film on the M3 as a guide for longevity for now. </font>

    <font face=”inherit”>I’d like to think at this stage the renderings would show the intended final design of most if not all items and styles and in a clear (er) rendering without the blurry images currently posted. Since they apparently don’t it almost seems pointless for these </font>discussions<font face=”inherit”>. At what point, being this close to production do you think this should happen?</font>

  • William Taber

    Member
    February 28, 2022 at 7:51 am

    Ingress/egress. I can learn to love a yoke – I’ll do what what must be done to charge my vehicle – not a fan of wraps, but you take what you can get…. but if my old knees make me pay every time I get in and out – forget it. I can’t wait for the chance to somehow try one on for size.

    • Gary Aulfinger

      Member
      March 1, 2022 at 8:27 pm

      Comfort and ingress/egress, for sure. The specs all sound exciting. Even if they’re only “close” it’ll be a fun and efficient ride. But if I can’t get in without hitting my head or hurting my back, what’s the point? I am hopeful that the clever aircraft-like door shape that curves the opening up into the roofline will mean lots of headroom getting in and out. So it will come down to the seat height (hip point) to be a shoe-in.

  • Kayleigh Venne

    Administrator
    February 28, 2022 at 11:47 am

    Hi Mark! Thanks for this thread. The Aptera team will be keeping an eye on it because this feedback is very valuable!

    One clarification – We still plan to have the side cameras, but just may have to have additional reflective material on the sides in addition to them, per guidelines.

    • IA -1

      Member
      February 28, 2022 at 2:00 pm

      Having both cameras and side view mirrors is good, but removing the 2 interior screens that would be dedicated to the left and right mirror view cameras would be a HUGE mistake. I have a motorcycle with mirror areas bigger than 10 sq.in. and even that is not enough. The 5″x 2″ side view mirrors are good for the regulations, but not for safety, the visibility in the Aptera would be slim to none. In order to have good visibility from the side view cameras you would have to have 2 dedicated interior screens with constant feedback from the cameras. One middle screen would not be sufficient for several reasons. When you move your eyes/head to the side view mirror you see the mirror but also with your peripheral vision you see outside of the side window. This makes a huge difference if you have to look straight at the screen behind the yoke (probably only when giving a turn signal) in order to see what is around you from both sides. When driving you have to look what is going on from both sides of your vehicle no matter if you want to change lanes or not. That’s why we will need separate screens with constant camera feedback, the side mirrors would be too small for safety reasons.

      Another big safety issue is the yoke. I have been racing karts, and it makes perfect sense to have a yoke for them, but not for a passenger vehicle. The karts (and all racing cars) have yokes that are mounted at the center of the “steering wheel”. Aptera’s rendering and Tesla’s yoke are not mounted at the center of the “wheel”, but at the top, which makes the entire steering eccentric and very weird to use. This creates issues not only for parking but for taking 90 degree curves as well. A yoke steering wheel should be a big NO for Aptera.

      With that being said, having 2 separate dedicated screens for the side view cameras would eliminate the need for the screen behind the yoke. The screen behind the steering wheel could be completely eliminated, or you can just position it the same way as in all cars that are on the street right now. Or you can add a head-up display (HUD) to show the speed and some other info.

      These two issues are not minor, they are legitimate safety issues.

      • Joshua Rosen

        Member
        February 28, 2022 at 2:13 pm

        I absolutely agree with IA-1. The side view camera’s need corner displays. Tesla just introduced a sideview feature where they put the picture on the center display, they don’t have side displays. I disabled it immediately after trying it. That placement is dangerous. You don’t immediately register which side of the car you are looking at. It’s very important to be able to glance left and glance right to see what’s happening on that side of the car. Corner display’s should give a better view than mirrors but if you put the camera display in the center it’s confusing and dangerous.

        • Curtis Cibinel

          Member
          February 28, 2022 at 5:04 pm

          Personally I love the idea of a behind the wheel display but it should be just the speed and rearview displays (not conditional based on signaling). The most important information for the driver is their surroundings so having it directly in their forward sight is a good idea. If the cameras are wide angle and had a simple indicator if a vehicle is in the blind spot/parallel it would be simple and safe. Hopefully we have a degree of customization in the software but avoiding extra displays that could be blocked by the passenger makes a vehicle far safer than traditional mirrors.

      • Bob Kirchner

        Member
        February 28, 2022 at 3:53 pm

        I agree that wherever the images from the side view cameras appear, they should be constant. Maintaining 360 degree situational awareness isn’t possible if you can only see to your side when your signal is on.

      • LoveAptera YokeDealbreaker

        Member
        August 29, 2022 at 3:14 pm

        Thank you IA-1 for bringing these important safety problems to the attention of Aptera’s staff!

    • Jon Arryn

      Member
      March 1, 2022 at 9:37 am

      That’s good news Kayleigh. With regard to the camera output, where will the images display? Many have noticed in the new renders, the interior/corner side view monitors are gone, but a new center monitor is present. The corner monitors seemed to be a more natural placement, with the center screen displaying minimal data (e.g… current speed/remaining range, etc..) but I suppose I could unlearn old habits. My first vehicle back in late 80’s was a ’66 Land Crusher (FJ40 Land Cruiser) which didn’t even have side mirrors (thanks Pops!), so I know I can adapt 🙂

    • DIRK WRIGHT

      Member
      August 20, 2022 at 11:05 am

      I suggest that Aptera stop emulating Tesla. Do your own thing instead. Musk is jealous of what you are doing and that’s a good thing. There is no need to admire what they are doing or who he is. He disdains your product anyway, apparently.

      Please keep the yoke. I am tall and steering wheels interfere with my seeing the instruments on other cars. I am 6’3″ and I hope I fit comfortably in the car.

      While there are features that I would prefer to have, Aptera is the only vehicle I actually want to own now. The car makes everything else look boring. I’m going to need to bring small cards or flyers because it’s going to attract a lot of attention. I’m also going to need purple reflective sunglasses and a silver lame jacket to go with it to complete the “spaceman” look.

      Please include IR filtering glass in the vehicle. Solar Glass Infrared Windshield Keeps Cars Cool | Safelite

      I prefer paint over a wrap because it’s far easier to repair paint.

      The biggest deal breaker for me is the cost. If it goes over $40,000 for the vehicle with 3 motors and 400 mile battery, then I’m out. I realize that the quoted price is not a contract and Aptera is free to charge as necessary, but too much is just too much for me.

      I suggest also that Aptera not make 4-wheel cars at all. The number of regulations you have to meet to make such a vehicle are astronomically harder than for a 3-wheel vehicle. I suggest that Aptera go in the opposite direction: make a single seat 3-wheeler with corner tilting function. Tilting into corners is popular for autocycles now and the reason is much better cornering. It also works great with a single person vehicle.

  • Paul Evans

    Member
    February 28, 2022 at 12:11 pm

    My mortality or major lack of health!

    • Bob Kirchner

      Member
      February 28, 2022 at 3:53 pm

      Or in my case, Poverty.

  • Timothy Sherbakov

    Member
    February 28, 2022 at 2:38 pm

    The Yoke wheel.

    All I ask is that at the time of purchase, please make a no cost option to have a normal steering wheel

    • Ray Holan

      Moderator
      February 28, 2022 at 6:02 pm

      Not a fan of the yoke wheel, but I see the advantage of having a clearer forward view that is not obstructed by the top half of a traditional steering wheel. The yoke is off-putting to me, but doesn’t rise to the level of deal-breaker. If the steering ratio is quick enough, I’d find it more acceptable. If I can make a 90 degree left or right turn with just a 1/4 turn of the yoke, that would win me over.

      • Lou Verner

        Member
        February 28, 2022 at 7:50 pm

        I’m with you, Ray! My problem is that the rendering makes it appear that the yoke is somehow attached to the center at the top of the 180 degrees, making it possible to grasp the yoke completely only at the bottom third of the arc. Can’t believe I’d find that either comfortable or safe.

        I do plan on flying out to SD to test drive for several days on various surfaces before buying, so I’ll make my decision at that point whether yoke (or anything else) is my deal breaker.

        • Ray Holan

          Moderator
          March 1, 2022 at 10:37 am

          Appreciate your thoughts on the yoke, Lou. Surprised no one has thrown out a “the yoke’s on us!” comment. I, too, plan to do a significant test drive before writing the big check to Aptera. Time will tell.

          • John Malcom

            Member
            March 1, 2022 at 10:43 am

            groan…….😖

          • Lou Verner

            Member
            March 1, 2022 at 10:55 am

            So sorry (Not!) that it was you who threw out the “yoke” and not me…egg on my face 😳!

            Still hoping our “due date” is close enough that we take that “xcountry” trip together we talked about earlier…assuming neither of us encounters a deal breaker. The 60 kW, AWD is on order for me, forgot what you’re getting…may negate any chance of showing up in SD around same time. Fingers crossed!

            • Ray Holan

              Moderator
              March 1, 2022 at 5:24 pm

              Lou, I hadn’t forgotten about joining forces for the trek West. I think it would be great to meet up with you when it comes time to get to Cali and do the test drive we’re both interested in doing. I believe you’re ahead of me in line — I reserved a 40KW AWD spec in early September 2021.

    • IA -1

      Member
      March 1, 2022 at 1:39 pm

      I see a lot of people are saying “I will try the yoke, maybe I’ll get use to it”. You can try a yoke steering wheel without having one. When you drive your car just try not to touch the top half of the steering wheel. It feels fine when driving on a highway, but try making a 90 degree turn, it’s very unusual and very dangerous. Same when you try to park your car. The yoke steering wheel makes perfect sense for racing cars, but it’s the worst wheel for any street car.

      • Sam Adams

        Member
        July 28, 2022 at 6:59 am

        Also try pretending a kid runs out between two parked cars while doing 25 mph

      • Francis Giroux

        Member
        August 25, 2022 at 1:27 pm

        While doing this sort of yoke test with your steering wheel, make it real by slathering petroleum jell on the part of the steering wheel you don’t want to touch.

      • LoveAptera YokeDealbreaker

        Member
        August 29, 2022 at 4:56 pm

        Record yourself trying this and post it on YouTube, and the other 99% of drivers that don’t have a Tesla or Aptera will be laughing at the stupidity of a yoke for the rest of time! 🙂 So the shame from yoke companies can be put to rest permanently, and rightly so.

        While you’re at it, why don’t we make all tires squircles, just like iPhones? I mean, sure we’ll all crash, but at least we’ll “look cool” doing it! (according to the “designers”)

  • Mark Steinback

    Member
    February 28, 2022 at 3:06 pm

    Interesting how so many people are objecting to the yoke steering!

    The only potential deal breakers to me would be safety related. Comfort (or lack thereof) could be, but I sat in one and it was fine. Performance could be, but with the low zero to sixty times and long range batteries these are non-issues.

    If I lived in a state that required a helmet, that would be a deal breaker.

    • Steven G. Bueche

      Member
      February 28, 2022 at 3:41 pm

      I agree, comfort. My 62 year old back can’t sit in some hard as a rock SUV seat. II’ve lost of the cushion back there darn it. lol

      Keep the center yoke / dash screen and the side screens.

      Tesla has the center screen show what’s on the left and right of the car when you signal a lane change. It’s nice but strange as stated above.

      Another breaker for me would be any secrete tracking device that allows my car to be shut off by remote control. Dang it if I want to smuggle Reese’s pieces from one state to another I don’t want Big Brother stopping me. He can get his at the next VFW meeting. lol

      If I’ve broken any guidelines my comments were made in jest.

      • This reply was modified 9 months ago by  Steven G. Bueche. Reason: Guidelines?
    • LoveAptera YokeDealbreaker

      Member
      August 29, 2022 at 5:00 pm

      The yoke is the biggest safety hazard in the history of the automobile. You will crash, not if, but when.

      Interesting how Aptera is ignoring so many customers that are cancelling due to forcing the safety hazard yoke on us! I know I had to cancel my order.

  • John LaRocque

    Member
    February 28, 2022 at 8:38 pm

    Safety is my only deal breaker (which I’m actually worried about).

    A few things which wouldn’t be great but on their own wouldn’t keep me from buying:

    • no federal EV tax credit (U.S.), or significant pricing increases
    • further delivery delays
    • not meeting my expectations on right to repair

    I’m not worried about minor changes to the interior design/ergonomics.

  • Llewellyn Evans

    Member
    February 28, 2022 at 9:17 pm

    I would definitely not buy one if the sun stopped shining.

    Effectively when the car is available I will get one because I see the elegance of it.

    My concerns are Yoke, side window bar blind spot, wrap longevity …. but these are not show stoppers and are concerns based on limited information.

  • Robert Klasson

    Member
    March 1, 2022 at 12:38 am

    There are three things that could stop me from getting an Aptera. My bank, EU legislation and EU localization.

    There’s no way I can save up enough money to buy one outright in time, so I need to be able to show the bank that it’s good value for the money so I can borrow the money needed.

    I wont buy it unless I can legally drive it in the EU.

    I won’t buy an Aptera that hasn’t been adapted to EU charging standards and it needs to be able to show EU units (km/h and km).

  • Steven Bryant

    Member
    March 1, 2022 at 9:43 am

    Price….

    • Steven Bryant

      Member
      March 14, 2022 at 9:02 am

      My demise or they don’t go into production

  • Paul Kirchner

    Member
    March 1, 2022 at 4:09 pm

    Thought I should put in my vote to provide offset for the yoke talk. If it works well, I don’t have a problem with it and would give a vote of “Yes”. There, that should offset one “no” vote.

    • This reply was modified 9 months ago by  Paul Kirchner. Reason: Misspelled
    • LoveAptera YokeDealbreaker

      Member
      August 29, 2022 at 5:05 pm

      I tried it and it doesn’t work at all. I drove a Tesla Plaid with a yoke and walked away disgusted.

  • Byron Dieckman

    Member
    March 1, 2022 at 4:29 pm

    I believe I would have to forego the dream if the entry and exit height was too low for me. I had to crawl out of my BMW Z-4 a few times….yes, sober, but now in my late 70’s. and the Z is history. Then again, my daughter-in-law in sunny Waco, Texas might be interested in a beautiful, efficient commuter with maxed out solar panels.

  • Markus Schmid

    Member
    March 1, 2022 at 5:59 pm

    For me the only dealbreaker would be if Aptera wouldn’t make it to production.

    • Jacob Schmugge

      Member
      March 14, 2022 at 3:11 am

      That would be a forced deal breaker for everyone.

  • James Pace

    Member
    March 1, 2022 at 10:00 pm

    Not quite deal breakers, but for me, very important features:

    – trailer hitch

    – 110v outlet to power camping and modest V2H demands in times of power outages. Additional 12v outlet would be nice but less important.

    – In-window defrost wires front and rear. Also in-seat heaters and steering wheel heat.

    Real deal breakers:

    – If I can’t drive the car safely in winter.

    – Snow/ice management especially around wheel wells. Engineers, please figure out how Saab 96s did it way back when. A similar design problem solved.

    – Along the same line, windows and cameras must have an automatic defrost and cleaning method. Stoping every mile to wipe off cameras will keep me from a purchase.

    – Touch screens that distract from driving, or take more than a moment to navigate.

    – Simple and effective emergency exit in case of roll overs or submergence in bodies of water. Pray for me, I drive Idaho highway 55. Drivers killed every year in the NF Payette canyon. I help recover the bodies.

    • Steven G. Bueche

      Member
      March 5, 2022 at 1:28 pm

      Mark what do you drive now and do they have these features?

      I for one would cringe at the site of an Aptera with a trailer hitch. If your body recovery business requires you to drive over ice and snow covered bridges then may I’d stick with a truck which seems a bit more suited to your mission.

      I understand everyone wants this car to be the do all be all but somethings it can’t. I’ve got camera on my M3 and besides the time I wash my car I never have to wipe the cameras. The cleaning systems are out there and I’m sure Aptera could figure a way of adding them but at what cost? These little nickel and dime items will send the cost out of the target market’s reach and hurt sales in the long run.

    • Michael Griffin

      Member
      March 22, 2022 at 8:46 pm

      It took me less than a day to become comfortable with the touch screen on my wife’s Tesla model 3. It’s not a distraction at all. Lack of knobs and such is no biggie really.

  • Elzo Stubbe

    Member
    March 2, 2022 at 11:46 am

    None. This is the dream. This stays the dream. For me there is nothing better driving around on the face of the earth….

  • my_discord_number_is_0328 bloody stupid

    Member
    March 2, 2022 at 8:14 pm

    give option for less space between driver and passenger. some of these things could be in next generation car

    -Making car less wide (b/c its too wide for europe and japan)

    This can help make up for shorter car if thats necessary to for balancing car under g force when making car narrower:

    1st pic: Cut off circled spaces:

    2nd pic: like VW xl1, elbows can be at passengers sides as naturally is yet width is less b/c his elbow or even shoulder/arm is behind driver.:

    3rd pic: like ariel nomad 4s, aerodynamic narrowness, can be a thin roll out or clip in barrier between occupants so people dont touch each other if thats what they want (ridesharing, etc), removable for people who want to be close (like with wife)

    4th pic: vague idea of a caterpillar track shaped motor to decrease vertical space thus bring wheel closer to center of car while keeping areodynamics. motor magnetisms changed so torque vantage comes from length of arrow, torque source is the circles (the circle wheel is pushing a lever (diamater of wheel) ). maybe the motor can stay the same circular motor but the wheels is a tank tread sort of thing.maybe the wheel road griping surface area would be too long, causing more tire wear?

    another way is have 2 small tank treads or wheels on either side of car but that will probably be heavier even though the connection between wheel and cabin is smaller. or, the tank tread/wheel can be next to each other, motor being on top of them, maybe with a gear sets like in picture 5 (smaller rectangles sort of shapes are gears, big rectangle in middle is motor, can put space between motor and grip surface area) or picture 6 (the side rectangles are gears).

    maybe have bigger wheel on outsider and smaller one closer to cabin, rounded cabin shape will curve around the 2 wheels with roughly equal space between the large and small tire. maybe just normal tank threads with inflated wheels.

  • Fanfare 100

    Member
    March 2, 2022 at 9:51 pm

    I actually like the yoke. A deal-breaker for me may either be:
    A) Further delay in delivery
    or
    B) Increase in price for existing reservation-holders, ala Rivian.

    Aside from that, I can’t think of any other.

  • George Hughes

    Member
    March 3, 2022 at 9:22 am

    As long as Aptera retains its essential value proposition, I’m in.

    I would hope to use my Aptera as an asset on a service like Turo where I rent it for a three-day test drive for a fee with the understanding being folks will be checking it out to buy.

    The problem with that plan is that while I may be willing to do so, I probably won’t get my Aptera until summer 2023, if I’m lucky. They may not even begin making deliveries to this market until then, in which case it may be 2024 before my reservation comes up. If so, it may be too late to do this gig. I mean if I rent it once a month, that would likely come close to covering the note; twice a month and you’re making money.

    It would really be kind of cool if there were a way to ease the path from being my customer in that rental to being Aptera’s customer for a new vehicle.

    But even if that avenue to riches is cut off the ‘resource’ of a vehicle that goes from point A to point B using energy that, for the most part is poached from the sun meaning that most magic of words: FREE transportation …

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