Wheel pants. Serious info.

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions Wheel pants. Serious info.

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions Wheel pants. Serious info.

  • Wheel pants. Serious info.

     kerbe2705 updated 5 days, 17 hours ago 12 Members · 19 Posts
  • Pistonboy Delux

    Member
    April 16, 2022 at 8:52 pm

    https://youtu.be/WgRF_O4ilhM

    This is a great video. This guy sounds serious and seasoned.

  • Steven G. Bueche

    Member
    April 17, 2022 at 2:52 am

    Thank you for posting this! Was this video posted on the interviewers UTube channel?

    This is the kind of video and information us geek/gear heads/technical types want to see. There were so many more questions I wanted to yell at the screen that this interviewer did not ask. He comes across as a non wrench guy who seems a bit unprepared for his mission.

    The engineer talks like all engineers do (lol) but he does give us loads of information. If I knew his name, I’d like to thank him for it.

    I think it might also help to distinguish the difference between dirt roads and rock climbing when they talk of Off Road capabilities. I personally don’t see the Aptera doing more than dirt roads with a few rocks but I drive a 4×4 Jeep Cherokee from 96.

    I like the concept of removable front and rear pieces for the wheel Pants. I don’t deal with curbs down in Georgia but, I understand the concern coming from an ex-city boy. I think off roaders would simply remove the wheel pants for any off road adventures and avoid the possibilities of damage. I also appreciate his explanation of snow accumulation and the effects it either will or will not have on tire performance and its removal. The addition of the center hub aliment for the outer shirt/pant is also a clever idea for pant stability.

    Not to keen on a no tool removal pins for the skirt as every car guy may know that for a avoidance of rattles a torqued fastener is best.

    Keep up the good work Aptera!

    Now if we could get one of our esteemed community engineers to interview these folks,…

    • Paul Schultz

      Member
      April 17, 2022 at 6:55 am

      I actually feel Steve from Aptera Owner’s Club has been doing a great job with his interview videos he has posted recently. I don’t need to know details of “maybe designs”. I like the fact that Aptera was willing to show one aspect of their design process as a representative of what they are doing behind the scenes.

      Paul

  • Elzo Stubbe

    Member
    April 17, 2022 at 4:47 am

    Even though I am a social worker, I really can appreciate the way Aptera shares all this highly technical inside information with everybody. Back in the days all this was highly confidential and never shared with anybody… A completely different way of thinking and sharing which, in my opinion, is a very positive development.

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 2 weeks ago by  Elzo Stubbe.
  • Pistonboy Delux

    Member
    April 17, 2022 at 8:41 am

    The wheelpants have lights on the front and top of them.

    I would like to have lights running down the back of them too.

    I am frequently passed by people who do not get over completely into the other lane. I fear they will be busy looking at the rest of the vehicle, not notice the front wheel sticking out, and hit the front wheels.

    At least have a bright LED light molded into the top light, facing backwards. It could be integrated into the present lights with no problem.

    • kerbe2705

      Member
      April 17, 2022 at 11:41 am

      Do other drivers frequently move into your lane and side-swipe your vehicle? There’s so much FUD about Aptera’s front wheels: When you view the vehicle from above you can see that the wheels don’t protrude an extravagant distance from the widest portion of the body.

      Having lights on the rear of the wheel pants would place them in full view of the driver: I’m guessing that having moving lights in my field of vision (remember, these lights would bounce and turn with the wheels, not with the body of the vehicle) would be somewhat distracting…

      • Pistonboy Delux

        Member
        April 17, 2022 at 11:56 am

        While no one has side-swiped my vehicle yet, they do frequently pass with part of their vehicle still in my lane. The smaller the vehicle, the less they move over completely into the other lane. Just ask motorcycle riders.

        I fear they will judge the width of the vehicle by the most obvious part which is the body. I fear they will not notice the less obvious parts, they wheelpants.

        • kerbe2705

          Member
          April 17, 2022 at 2:40 pm

          A motorcycle is not larger than a Prius – an Aptera is. I live in the land of pick-up trucks and rarely, if ever, see their side-view mirrors ripped off and lying by the side of the road. Aptera’s wheel pants stand at least 20″ tall and are nearly 3′ long: I doubt that ANYONE will have difficulty seeing them.

          Plus don’t discount “defensive driving”: If you see another driver encroaching into your lane it behooves you to blow your horn and swerve out of their way!

  • Curtis Cibinel

    Member
    April 17, 2022 at 11:45 am

    Great interview. So much good technical information.

    I’m still unclear why the waste heat wont melt the snow easily. I calculated 150-300 watts of heat per wheel (90-95% efficiency) if driving at 60mph / 100 kph with the FWD (6000 watts total = 100 wh/mile). With how enclosed it is this should melt off the snow any time you stop. The wheel motor / wheel are heavy hunks of metal which will hold this heat. Maybe it wont overcome R losses at -40 C/F but at -5 to -10C (23-14F) it should be plenty

    • Gary Greenway

      Member
      April 18, 2022 at 10:47 am

      I, too, am worried about snow buildup in the wheelpants. Especially the rear. With all the wind passing through the wheel motors and the active liquid cooling while traveling down the road, I’m guessing the motors won’t be much above ambient. However, when parked in a garage while charging, it would be easy to heat the wheels up enough to melt adjacent ice. The two methods I can think of are routing warm coolant into the wheel motors or phasing the wheel inverters to run current through the wheel motors to produce heat in the motors yet keep the rotors stationary. I’m sure the wheel motors already have temperature sensors built in to monitor thaw mode temps.

  • my_discord_number_is_0328 bloody stupid

    Member
    April 17, 2022 at 2:50 pm

    why dont they cover the botton to prevent ice fron getting in more, that way big ice piecs wont get stuck which could cause friction against the wheel. around the wheel cna be tight space , so if any piec go in its small and probably itll break or pass by without casuing much friction under engine torque.

  • Paul Schultz

    Member
    April 18, 2022 at 3:05 am

    In the video the engineer mentions the wheel working “like a lathe” in that it will continue to carve out its space as any snow builds up in the inner portion of the wheel well/pant. What they don’t mention is the issue, albeit less common, of snow/ice building up on the inner cavity of the wheel itself. This can happen if snow sprays up into this cavity during driving. When you park it slides to the bottom of the inside wheel cavity, freezes, and leads to your wheel feeling grossly imbalanced when you subsequently go for a drive. When this has happened with our vehicles I have been able to break this free with some machinations. To remove this snow/ice on the Aptera I would think it would require the removal of the wheel pant…. something I would want to avoid in winter weather if possible. I wonder if Aptera has done any simulations for snow/ice build-up on the inner wheel cavity?

    • Steven G. Bueche

      Member
      April 18, 2022 at 3:49 am

      Good Morning Paul. If there’s that much snow on the ground I would think your speeds are low enough that you wouldn’t need the wheel pant on at all and avoid the issue since aerodynamics and efficiency isn’t an issue. I know some states have issue with un-fendered wheels so this may not be possible. If you look at the motor companies site you’ll see they’ve tested this issue pretty extensively. So I don’t think it’s an issue. Like Steve says in the video, clay is a bigger concern. I think mud could be easily removed with a hose attachment similar to a mower deck that allows for easy grass clean out. Besides these issues you speak of are the same for any wheel.

      • Paul Schultz

        Member
        April 18, 2022 at 5:27 pm

        The issue of eccentric ice build-up on the inside wheel cavity may be common to all wheels but when I have dealt with the issue I have had access to the inner wheel without removing a wheel pant. This is something I don’t want to do in the bitter cold of an upper midwest winter.

    • Peter Jorgensen

      Member
      April 18, 2022 at 7:16 am

      Great question. There isn’t much clearance between the hub motor and the wheel rim – probably 1/2″ at most. So it could build up in there but probably not a lot. But I know it doesn’t take much. I had a subaru in a previous life that would collect snow in between the spokes on my winter tires (but not the summer tires ironically) and get grossly imbalanced. It was only an issue when I was in deep heavy concrete snow then got on the highway after without cleaning out the spokes.

  • GLENN ZAJIC

    Member
    April 18, 2022 at 10:06 am

    Thank you…thank you… thank you!!! Steve did a fine job, as usual, with this interview. But Aptera did an even better job with their wobbly wheel pants solutions. I must say I was more than a little concerned after the Leno drive with this issue. I was in fear of them putting out something that seemed like a piece of you know what. I guess I should have known better! Way to go Aptera!!

    • Jonah Jorgenson

      Member
      April 18, 2022 at 3:43 pm

      We need to trust them to do their job

  • Kimberly Wilson

    Member
    June 25, 2022 at 8:30 pm

    I wonder why the wheelpants/spats don’t have the same profile as the car body. Since the car body is close to the ideal aero shape, accounting for ground effects turbulence, why then aren’t the pants/spats the same shape?

    • kerbe2705

      Member
      June 25, 2022 at 9:48 pm

      @Kimberly Wilson – because they serve a different purpose and because they interact with the airflow around the body. If the shapes were identical they’d generate a great deal of turbulence.

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