What’s up with Sandy Monro?

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions What’s up with Sandy Monro?

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions What’s up with Sandy Monro?

  • What’s up with Sandy Monro?

     John Voules updated 3 weeks ago 9 Members · 16 Posts
  • George Hughes

    Member
    September 5, 2022 at 4:53 pm

    While it is common knowledge that Sandy Monro, who has become an icon in the EV industry world-wide, is an ‘investor’ in Aptera he’s been very reserved in talking about Aptera. I assume that is because of the NDA’s he has as part of his consulting contract with Aptera.

    And he did have that first sit down with Chris where they went through the concept of the vehicle. I recall, for instance, his observation of the crashworthiness of Aptera in that quarter-front barrier impact test. But I’ve not hardly heard a peek, only a few video snippets of him in the production facility.

    I did the notice he’s going to be at the show on the 10th. I also noted Archimoto, whom he also provides significant consulting and promotion – he has been present at some big Archimoto events providing his respected opinions on the vehicles.

    I’m just wondering if he’s going to speak about Aptera in some official “Aptera” capacity or is he here because of Archimoto or a specific invitation from the show itself. I suspect it may be the latter, that the folks from the show who also list Corey Stuben as a panelist in one of the presentations.

    Also, are the events going to be livestreamed? I suspect we’ll get some reports from folks ranging from the Aptera Owners Club, Monro Live, Transportation Evolved and Drive the Lightening as well as others.

  • Len Nowak

    Moderator
    September 5, 2022 at 5:07 pm
    • George Hughes

      Member
      September 5, 2022 at 6:53 pm

      Thank’s for the poster Len. I looked at the program but the images as they displayed on my refurb 17-inch chromebook were pretty hard to make out as the type was extra small on the small screen and there was some kind of zoom max that was far below what I do on a real PC.

      Chris, the show’s host and Monro are unveiling the Aptera. That’s cool. I would have thought that deserved a topic of its own instead of a few casual mentions, almost in passing.

      What is happening in personal transportation is a revolution that changes how and where we get our energy. With much of this new energy coming from the sun – all we have to do is capture it – this effort challenges the powers that be in the legacy energy industry. This is a conflict and the new energy folks have a trump card – adopt solar, wind with storage because the alternative is we sink, for starters, Miami and Manhattan. The challenge is we have to do this quickly or it doesn’t make any difference.

      These guys are key influencer’s in this space – especially Monro … and this is on top of his value as a consultant on lean manufacturing.

      • John Malcom

        Member
        September 5, 2022 at 7:45 pm

        Perhaps influencers in the retail space, not so much where it is needed right now and that is the capital acquisition space. Sandy has been publicly associated with Aptera for sometime but Aptera is still struggling to get capital to go to production.

        Still, once in a startup’ s lifetime for their 10 minutes of fame. Lets hope it is enough to jumpstart the flow of investment. Hopefully gamma is sufficiently finished to make a good impression. At least we know it is the Sol.

        • George Hughes

          Member
          September 5, 2022 at 11:54 pm

          I don’t know, Monro was there with the profitable low volume Dodge Viper project; he was involved with GM’s EV-1, his company has reverse engineered and production priced more EVs down to the cost of welds than anyone else in the world.

          As I understand it, he has been crowned the living successor of Demming’s ideas of simplified; or as Monro and Associates say, lean manufacturing.

          The point is that if you are a smart investor, the reputation a company gets in the market is going to be based on your research which, for a smart investor, includes more than the numbers.

          Because of Monro’s contribution to Aptera, which was to sort out and design the assembly procedure and rationalize production costs, largely by a professional ethic that emphasizes minimizing the number of parts and therefore the cost of operations.

          From my perspective, if Monro waxes on about how simple the assembly is and how few man-hours are involved means the assembly is really inexpensive despite use of premium materials like the composites. Indeed, the assembly process, with its component-orientation and construction method is just about as revolutionary as the efficiency-orientation of the Aptera.

          • John Malcom

            Member
            September 6, 2022 at 8:28 am

            At a time when capital is in such short supply and EV companies are doing so poorly even after being capitalized with some variation of an IPO, the only thing venture capitalist look at are the numbers. And for ANY EV manufacturer look for additional funding, even thoes that are already in production, the well is pretty much dry. An endorsement by Sandy Monro, regardless of his standing in the auto manufacturing industry will do little to influence the potential capital providers big enough to help Aptera.

            What is needed to attract the capital is a validated stream of future business. Aptera has this to some degree in their reservations. But a $100 refundable reservation is a weak representation of future business. Documented orders would be. A record of fiscal responsibility with their spending. (Aptera has this in spades. They have done more with less than any other startup I know) A vehicle ready for production. (This is where Aptera falls short. They have a record of not meeting their schedule for more than a year and we are not sure that, for the event starting this Saturday, they will have a fully functional gamma) If Aptera doesn’t, then difficult to believe a claim that a delta is shortly behind and they will deliver production vehicles at the end of this year or shortly after the start of 2023. Most likely the vagaries of the supply chain are responsible for the gamma not being complete if it is not, but you don’t get a pass for supply chaton issues from capital investors.

            What venture capitol institutions want is to invest and get a decent return soonest and to have some control over the the venture invested in. No venture capital unit will have the latter with Apteral so only the return is a draw. And the numbers are not strong for that outcome.

            Still, Aptera has pulled a rabbit out of the hat before. and somehow they will d o it again.

            • George Hughes

              Member
              September 6, 2022 at 1:23 pm

              John:

              If Aptera were limited to traditional capital markets, it would have been dead in the water back in 2019. Why?

              Because the ‘individual interests’ of many of our most ruthless capitalists including institutional investors are ‘invested’ in fossil fuels. The students at Harvard and Yale are protesting the investments of those schools endowments in perpetrating the reliance on burning fuels, racism, sexism, etc.

              These people, while they can be influenced by numbers, recognize additional interests: their interest in maintaining their power and, yes, hiring a hundred people to do high-value taxpayers in the IRS, will no doubt restrict their capital. But this self-serving portion of the capital markets are often investing in lobbying because of the risks vs. rewards from owning politicians (low taxes and minimal oversight). Some in this rarified group measure their success in the width of the gap between the rich and poor.

              It is not totally a partisan thing; two senators literally neutered the EV portion of the inflation bill, by limiting credits/grants for EVs based on the source of their lithium and other chemicals. This is a blatant EV delaying tactic – i.e. requiring something that practically does not exist and won’t exist for at least two or three years at the earliest in quantity.

              The expected economics of Solar Electric vehicles is that this tech will be dramatically less expensive for the user, lowering the traditional tariff’s that apply to ICE vehicles. This makes the Aptera a potentially dramatically disruptive technology.

              The impact of the politics is such that a direct comparison between the states of Georgia and California. In CA, there are state incentives to consumers to buy and use EVs. In Georgia, the ‘extra – applies only to EVs’ state license fee charges me the cash equivalent of road taxes an average American car would pay if it got 20 mpg over 90,000 miles annually. (When the state abated state road tax during this past summer’s gas price peak, there was no ‘rebate’ on the state road tax for EVs.)

              The point John:

              If Aptera were limited to traditional capital markets, it would have been dead in the water back in 2019. Why?

              Because the ‘individual interests’ of many of our most ruthless capitalists including institutional investors are ‘invested’ in fossil fuels.

              Remember the old saw, “the ability to tax is the ability to destroy.” That is the pro-fossil fuel policy of this Red state’s general assembly.

              The students at Harvard and Yale are protesting the investments of those schools endowments in perpetrating the reliance on burning fuels, racism, sexism, etc.

              These people, while they can be influenced by numbers, are more interested in maintaining their power and, yes, hiring a hundred people to do high-value taxpayers in the IRS, will no doubt restrict their capital. But this self-serving portion of the capital markets are often investing in lobbying because of the risks vs. rewards from owning politicians (low taxes and minimal oversight). Some in this rarified group measure their success in the width of the gap between the rich and poor.

              The expected economics of Solar Electric vehicles is that this tech will dramatically less expensive for the user, lowering the traditional tariff’s that apply to ICE vehicles.

              The impact of the politics is such that a direct comparison between the states of Georgia and California. In CA, there are state incentives to consumers to buy and use EVs. While Georgia, EV owners pre-pay road taxes more indicative of the inefficiencies of ICE vehicles.

              The sad thing is they pull this screw the EV market supporters with a straight face.

              Let me conclude, while Monro will have limited influence on the traditional capital markets whose interests conflict with sustainable products conflicts with their embrace of planned obsolescence, his influence will influence hoards of smaller investors.

              Consider that if roughly ten percent (3000) of the new and current reservation holders were to up their personal investment by $8000 each, combined with California’s grant and you’ve got your $50 million. Then there is the federal loan program that could come into play and given the current administration’s range of options and investment in ‘building back better,’ they are a lot more apt to act than prior administrations – especially if there is a strong grass-roots effort at fund-raising.

              As far as the venture capitalists, there are always going to be outliers – those who have divested from the fossil fuel sector would represent one potential target as they obviously have a conscious.

              That said, I endorse your confidence Aptera will solve this dilemma.

              I would add one more thing to this grand effort to reach production.

              This is just an idea but I think the after-market 12-volt battery supplier with the “Die-Hard” brand may find a way to expand their the engagement with that brand by being a named sponsoring supplier.

              The engineering creation of specific complex component manufacturing process opens the door to the commodification of components. For instance, Aptera’s front box-frame/suspension/motor component could be adapted to entirely different monocoques.

              The way to understand this is to look at Dell computers vs. Apple. Dell’s are made of largely open-market components and software that are engineered to work with a wide variety of sources of internal components like chips (Intel/AMD option), hard drives/SSD’s (various brands), memory chips, power supplies, etc. which are largely interchangeable and support. Apple’s are like Tesla which seeks to make all components proprietary.

              The point being each one of the component and even sub-component manufacturers want to establish, in essence, a secondary consumer market for their goods.

              It is obvious the supply chain should be ‘invested’ in Aptera as doing so has the added advantage of expanding the potential geographic market for distribution of proven EV components that can be repurposed into retro-fits as well as new concepts like the four-wheel Aptera inspired models.

              The beginnings of this EV aftermarket are already flourishing fueled by both new components and those obtained from the salvage stream. The reason such a development in the market is critical is there is no way we can decarbonize personal transportation without retro-fitting with plug-in hybrid capability. This requires ‘components’ much like those used by Aptera. For instance, front-drive econoboxes could well benefit from small, in-wheel motors and a decent (10-25kw) battery and regen.

              While components from both the salvage and new component supply chain is essential, also essential is the knowledge of how to efficiently adapt these components to existing vehicles requires a dramatic increase. One could even imagine, in the case of a say a RWD sedan, a single wheel motor for use by grandma’s putting around town in their Towncar (Boy she loves that boat 😉 )

              The point is the excitement and enthusiasm surrounding Aptera means Aptera has the potential to drive a significant maturation of this secondary market because, in essence, it is the fruition of this kind of innovation in distribution and assembly.





            • John Malcom

              Member
              September 6, 2022 at 1:44 pm

              A double post here I think. Love the forum software.

              The point is Aptera is limited to traditional capital markets and their culture and rules at this point because “They” have the money, especially if Aptera’s intention is to do an IPO. None of the conditions you cite will change between now and an IPO for Aptera. That is one of the reasons they hired a CFO with IPO experience. The other point is crowd funding from small investors will not provide enough capital or provide it fast enough to support a smooth and expeditious move to production.

            • Kimberly Wilson

              Member
              September 7, 2022 at 2:58 pm

              Maybe Marc Lore would like to invest. He’s concerned about the future.

              https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telosa

            • Richard Palmisano

              Member
              September 8, 2022 at 10:11 am

              The funding issue is huge IMHO.

              In the current environment, the ability to raise capital, is pretty bleak. There aren’t many willing to invest in startups. It’s not as if Aptera hasn’t been beating the drum already for the past couple years without a major capital influx, other than stock offering rounds.

              Lean it good. Starving is bad.

            • John Voules

              Member
              September 8, 2022 at 10:17 am

              Personally, my hope is that APTERA who already is receiving 22 million from California and will be raising more through the present open funding, that they will not need an influx of big dollar investors. They maybe able to reach a point where a smaller loan maybe better for all involved. Won’t dilute stock and no new board members to deal with.

    • kerbe2705

      Member
      September 5, 2022 at 11:26 pm

      This tells us that it’s not the design buck they’ve been using for the recent Gamma videos and photos – which is obviously a Luna with Codex interior.

  • David Marlow

    Member
    September 6, 2022 at 6:20 am

    So a Gamma Sol? They have had time to build at least two Gammas while waiting for something. We will see.

    • John Malcom

      Member
      September 6, 2022 at 8:30 am

      It isn’t always a matter of time. In this case I think a matter of available capital.

    • Norman Roberts

      Moderator
      September 6, 2022 at 10:23 am

      Just received email from Aptera . Sol in show guide is typo ! The Luna Gamma will be at show

      • John Malcom

        Member
        September 6, 2022 at 10:54 am

        Ha! Thanks for the correction! I thought it looked a little “Gray” to be the Sol. but you never know.

        • This reply was modified 3 weeks, 2 days ago by  John Malcom. Reason: corrected spelling
Viewing 1 - 3 of 3 replies

or to reply.

Original Post
0 of 0 posts June 2018
Now